an email I sent to the parntership for a drug free california...

[battlegroup]

Re: Re: Not quite!

Originally posted by irbodden


I'd be willing to bet tabacco costs cover more then the Medicad. In that case, they are a benefit to the average person eh?

Prove it!

[battlegroup]

Originally posted by irbodden


Ignorance.

What? I have first hand knowledge and I'm ignorant! Yep!

Originally posted by irbodden

First off, your brother would have gotten to crack if there was pot or not. I will never, ever, stoop as low as smoking CRACK. Regardless if I smoke marijuana or not.

Yeah, because you know my brother and have talked to him! I'm sure he was thinking when he first started pot that "I'll just do this until I can get crack" Ridiculous! He even told us that he was addicted to the high but couldn't get it anymore and went on to other stuff.

Originally posted by irbodden

Secondly, do you really believe all the tax made off cig sales goes towards helping people suffering because of them?
Last time I checked, we didn't have a socialist medicare program.

Cigarretes MAKE the government money, not loose money.

What does socialism have to do with anything? I'm saying Cigarette cause more problems than they solve!

[joeyjoe367]

Originally posted by InfinatyBPS
LOL @ Gotenks, look like I'm going to have to do more Jogging...

and Joeyjo, Do you even know why its illegal? Also, I fail to see how its immoral, it seems that you have been getting your morals from the wrong place, and you have been just taking in the mindless crap that the media and government is feeding you. I don't know about you but I don't see what is immoral about feeling good and a little bit dizzy for a couple hours from burning a plant Like if you found out that eating oregano or something like that made you lose weight or gain muscle faster, or just made you feel good and you ate it would you feel like you did something immoral?

Is being a drunkard immoral? Ask most people, and they'll say yes. It's no differant for a pot-head, IMO.

I don't know what "mindless" media you're talking about. I don't watch TV or listen to the radio. I know in myself, that getting high/drunk/whatever is immoral, and that's my belief. If you don't agree with that, then fine. My arguing isn't going to change your oppinion, i don't believe.

Having Oregano make me lose weight or gain muscle would be GREAT. Marijuana doesn't do that, and the comparison you're making is absurd.

[battlegroup]

Originally posted by irbodden


DARWINISM!

They pay for schools! For Roads! Should they become illegal, is that the idea? I am sure the market will love it in when Phillip Morse crashes 900%...

?????
Darwinism? Suvival of the fittest? What are you talking about? Yes Cigarette tax brings in a lot of money But I think such a large portion of it (if not all) is being used for long term care of those who are suffering from the effects of smoking. I for one do not support anything tobacco! I don't care If we do lose money comming in and my taxes do go up! And if the market goes down because of it, It doesn't bother me because all of my investments are Tobacco free! Should I care what the market does if tobacco is outlawed? I would rather think about my grandmother that died from lung cancer from living with a smoker!

[SlartyBartFast]

Originally posted by battlegroup
PROTECTING FREEDOM SINCE 1989

I'm very vocally anti-smoking. Yet your sig is a very ironic. True freedom is also the freedom to be stupid.

Personally my stand on drugs is it's a fools game trying to control the criminals. Decriminalise and legalise many of the substances. THen you have quality control and tax income.

Just as long as users have to live with the stupidity of their choices and I don't have to support them. Also of course that I am protected from their stupidity and Free to live my life smoke and drug free.

[battlegroup]

Originally posted by irbodden


You smoke, you loose.

What about me? I have never smoked in my life but my parents did. I almost died when I was 12 because of a adverse reaction to an allergy shot. I had allergies so bad with breathing problems antagonized by my parents smoking that I required 2 shots every week. The stopped smoking after that and Amazingly enough my allergies subsided.

Also what about all the house fires from people falling asleep with a lit cigarette? I see it on the news often enough that I know there are innocent people dieing!

[1stdeadeye]

Wrong!

Originally posted by SlartyBartFast

Actually you should do your homework. There are many fine internationally renowned health care facilities in Canada. The Royal Victoria in Montreal is known for it's work in brain surgery and mental illness. Toronto's children's hospital is also world renowned. Many americans study at McGill university here in Montreal because of the quality of the education AND the low cost.

Canadians (Quebecers) currently go to Plattsburgh for treatment for certain cancers, but that's because of a shortage of nurses, oncologists, and anesthetists. A situation that many areas all over North America are facing.



That's questionable. Sure it's the best as long as you can afford it. And if you WERE insured the first time you were seriously ill, you better hope you never fall ill again and that you can find a job. You'll have hundreds of thousands in bills to pay and never get insurance again.

I think Britain or Sweden would qualify as the best based on standard of care and access to services. Canada has some serious problems with access to services and general funding. However, when a family member had triple bypass surgery, and years later a very serious stroke, the service was there and it was free.



Turning it over to the government is not the only way to go. I actually believe that it's the wrong way to go. Britain's public private partnerships (PPP) seem to be the most balanced approach.

To provide more services to those in need, universal access isn't even needed. The US government and individual insurance policy holders could save millions (billions?) if the insurance industry was forced to use standardised insurance forms. The savings could then provide services to those currently left out. Legislating minimum insurance policy levels would ensure that no one became uninsurable.



Now you're really wrong. Montreal has one of the largest concentrations of drug research and manufacturing companies in North America.

Pharmaceutical costs are a large part of our health care costs as well. The same is true throughout the world. But, as our system caps the prices that drug manufacturers can charge many Americans are finding it profitable to take day bus trips over the border to buy their drugs at Canadian pharmacies.

The true injustice in drug manufacturing and sales is that many drugs are developed by the US CDC and other government research departments. They then give the drug to a manufacturer to market. The AIDS drugs for example that Al Gore had to strike a deal with the Africans over were drugs developed with US taxpayer money, given to a company headed by a good friend of Al. Those drugs now account for the majority of that company's billion dollar profits.

I don't think I can really fault poor countries like India and those in the Pacific Rim deciding to not sign on the patent treaties that protect profit before the life of their citizens. Canada took the same stand recently when the company that provides the anti-Anthrax drug refused to provide sufficient quantities to the Canadian government. We had a generic drug manufacturing company make it so that we could be protected.

Where are you getting your facts. You are so wrong. First the CDC does not create any of the drugs that US companies patent. You are thinking of NIH and they do create some, not most! It is not a matter of profit over life, it is a matter of staying in business. A few of my clients are researchers in Delaware. Do you know how many drugs fail for everyone that is approved? US companies pour billions into research to create these drugs. If they can't recoup their costs, they go under. Now the world will have to invent their own drugs instead of STEALING them from the US.

As for Canadian and English healthcare, they are fine for general services, but God help you if you need a specialist. One of my best friends daughter lives in London. Her son has a very rare blood disorder. English specialists could not help him. He was brought to the premier Children's Hospital in the world CHIPS (Children's Hospital in Philadelphia). After less then 2 weeks there, he was back to being a normal three year old. My Canadian cousin went to Baltimore to the FINEST HOSPITAL IN THE WORLD, Johns Hopkins for cancer surgery!

Say what you want, but when you must have the best, the address of the hospital has USA in it!

[battlegroup]

Originally posted by SlartyBartFast


I'm very vocally anti-smoking. Yet your sig is a very ironic. True freedom is also the freedom to be stupid.

Personally my stand on drugs is it's a fools game trying to control the criminals. Decriminalise and legalise many of the substances. THen you have quality control and tax income.

Just as long as users have to live with the stupidity of their choices and I don't have to support them. Also of course that I am protected from their stupidity and Free to live my life smoke and drug free.

As long as stupid people don't infringe on my freedom to breath clean air and not have some drugged up driver wipe out me or my family while driving a car! I don't see how that is being ironic?

[SlartyBartFast]

Originally posted by 1stdeadeye
Where are you getting your facts. You are so wrong

[SlartyBartFast]

Originally posted by battlegroup
As long as your stupidity doesn't infringe on my freedom to breath clean air and not have some drugged up driver wipe out me or my family while driving a car!

I'd seriously appreciate if you edited that post. Re-read what I said. You've agreed absolutly with what I said so I don't think you're justified in commenting on my stupidity.

[RetroEclipseMan]

To get the thread back on topic I have to say that those commercials are totally false. I think they are just exagerated greatly to really scare kids out of smoking. Also how they say that smoking 1 joint is like smoking 4 cigarettes is a bit much I think. How many people out there actually smoke a whole joint to themselves. Most of the time from personal experience it's just with a group of people.

I just think the government should legalize it so they can cash in on all the tax's that would be raised from it. Not to mention the fact that they could control who gets it much easier and maybe keep it out of the hands of kids much more effectively. Cause you have to admit that getting pot which is totally illegal is much easier than getting alcohol which is not and that's because the government can control the sale of it much easier. That's just my $.02 on the matter.

[SlartyBartFast]

Originally posted by RetroEclipseMan
I think they are just exagerated greatly ...

Exageration?!? In a commercial?!?

You've GOT to be kidding right?

[battlegroup]

Originally posted by SlartyBartFast


I'd seriously appreciate if you edited that post. Re-read what I said. You've agreed absolutly with what I said so I don't think you're justified in commenting on my stupidity.

I was speaking as you did saying that "as long as those that are stupid......" Sorry if there was confusion.

[1stdeadeye]

Wrong again!

Originally posted by SlartyBartFast

Now who is resulting to insults! Where are you getting your facts. It is indisputable that the USA has the best medical facilities in the world! People don't travel to Canada for their healthcare.

Yes America has it's problems, but healthcare is not one of them. First, no one in any state in the USA may be turned away from a hospital for emergency care. That is against the law. People without insurance are paid for by government programs, in New Jersey, It is called CharityCare. Second Medicaid takes care of the truly poor in our society. Finally, do you know anything about NIH. It is the National Institutes of Health. It is one of the finest, if not the best medical research facility in the world. They draw researchers from all accorss the globe here. Further, all the treatment they provide is completely 100% FREE. NIH doesn't charge one cent for their services.

I am not a loudmouth American, but I will call a spade a spade! Where is your proof of R&D expenses in the Pharmaceutical industry? I heard it does not count. Please read an annual statement for J&J, SmithKline, or any other major drug company. You can then quate me real figures instead of made up numbers. I am a shareholder of GlaxoSmithKline, I've seen the reports have you?

I never claimed the US is the center of the universe, but show me a better collection of healthcare facilities anywhere in the world. Realize that for any major specialized care, people usually come to the U.S. for treatment. They also get it here at little to no cost. Check out Johns Hopkins some time. Then get back to me.

You sound to me like a typical Canadian whiner upset that your little country lives in the shadow of the world's lone remaining superpower.

BTW As a native of the Washington DC area, Thanks for the Montreal Expos, we will take very good care of them!

[irbodden]

Re: Wrong again!

Originally posted by 1stdeadeye
Please read an annual statement for J&J, SmithKline, or any other major drug company. You can then quate me real figures instead of made up numbers. I am a shareholder of GlaxoSmithKline

Pharmacia buddy.......