Who won the debate?

[FactsOfLife]

you republican goon
kerry won, simply for not being an idiot who lies to his country.

I don't even know where to start with this one...

[matt-o]

hah, im half messin around with you, i love seeing flame wars online
but seriously bush needs to stop misinforming everyone, stop shifting blame, and stop making it so it looks like someone isnt patriotic if they dont support him, eg. thepatriot act, the name itself implies that if you dont waive constituional rights you arent a patriot

[1stdeadeye]

you republican goon
kerry won, simply for not being an idiot who lies to his country.

Be mature or be gone!

[matt-o]

all the hashness in that was simply a joke

but the points in my last post do stand

*edit* can me and facts have the flame war we're both itching for?

[1stdeadeye]

*edit* can me and facts have the flame war we're both itching for?

You don't want that kid. Facts would beat you down hard! Ask Collegeboy!

[matt-o]

quite possibly, but would he beat all the democrats on AO, i dont think so seeing as AO is mostly teenagers and kids like kerry
plus i do know the difference between right and wrong
*edit* but whatever, for the sake of keeping the peace ill call it a draw, also in the poll kerry is in italics, whats with that? typo?

[RevBrown]

so your saying the less intelligent the debater, the more you like him??

I would like you to point out anywhere in my previous post where I mentioned the intelligence of either cantidate.

FOL is right, I don't like the guy that has to resort to alot of foofery.

[matt-o]

foofery?

[RevBrown]

foofery?

His word not mine.

[-Carnifex-]

Clearly Kerry did. Saying otherwise is just ludicrous.

[Miscue]

Clearly Kerry did. Saying otherwise is just ludicrous.

I give him an A for presentation, C for content. I give Bush a C for presentation, B+ for content. I agree, he clearly won the superficial part of the debate - the only part that your average Joe can evaluate.

How did Kerry specifically say he would solve the U.S.'s problems?
How did Bush say this?

http://www.debates.org/pages/trans2004a.html

If the transcript is read - no voices - no visuals - no judging of posture - no seeing someone who appears to be tired... it's easier to see who won on content, and not on superficial items.

[Miscue]

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Now don't get me wrong. I don't think either candidate is the greatest. Plus I feel the whole "flip flop" thing is politics. All politicians have done something similar in their past. Also FoL I've noticed more informative and explanitory posts from you, rather then the "effing Liberals" you used to be counted on saying.

I think no matter what is also said on the debates, most people have made up their minds on who they are gonna vote for.

Whole flip-flop thing is politics? Well, you're right! The flip-flopping is done for purely political reasons - supporting what is most beneficial to him at the given time. Do you agree that he flip-flops? Can you explain better than I have as to why he does this?

I have a problem with Kerry for condemning Bush for going to war - when he voted for it! "He also promised America that he would go to war as a last resort." Kerry voted for it and said it was a good idea!!! You can't condemn someone for something you supported yourself, while you remain in the right - simultaneously.

"I think that's wrong, and I think we can do better." He never really explains how! Anybody can say that. You can ALWAYS say that "we can do better." You can always say you gotta a bigger jimmy than someone else too, but never whip it out. This is what Kerry is doing.

All politicians have done something similar? I'd like to believe that at least one counter-example exists - where this person actually believes in something and sticks to it.

[Miscue]

effing liberals...

You know, I don't think it's even a matter of liberals and conservatives. These "liberals" are not consistently liberal - and can be in complete contradiction. I am personally more liberal than I am conservative - but I'm not one of "those" liberals in the least bit. Intelligent liberalism is very important, and we have something to gain from it - and we have gained from it.

I think there's something much deeper, and I don't have a word to label these people - and I've been trying to characterize them in my mind but I can't quite do it yet. And these people just happen to be associated with liberalism because that's just how it works out - almost accidentally.

Liberal has almost mutated into a synonym for idiot. I think we either need a different word other than "liberal" to label these people, or use it more sparingly - when it is contextually correct... and refer to someone as a liberal when it is very accurate.

[nastymag]

Kerry said over and over again " he was wrong"

Bush said over and over again " It's hard work ...its hard work"


yea, i really think Kerry won.
but it wasnt much for content either way

[FactsOfLife]

One thing about this debate that hasn't been mentioned/noticed.

In debates there are two sides Pro and Con. The Con side in this case Kerry had the major advantage of response while the Pro side, Bush, had to state positions first. Always a tough place to be in.

Looking at the last few presidential debates, I don't think the President is in any serious trouble here.

He wiped AlGore up in the dabtes with him, Ronaldus Magnus lost his first debate in 1980 and went on to win the next ones and the office.

I would expect that President Bush would be sitting down going over where the public thinks he was weak in the next week or so and fix it.

I personally would not be suprised to see him attack Kerry on his crap Senatorial record. If that happens, it's over for Kerry.