Valentine's Day now Vagina Day--Penis Day celebrations go soft.

[tsc]

Way to go! Stereotype all feminists to the point where we're just feminist because we can't get guys. Oh, and we're all pro-abortion lesbians who want to eat babies. Woooo.

No, but the women who are anti male-empowerment (yes, there is such a thing), are.

On the other hand; you can't call yourself a feminist unless oyu believe in equality, and that's not all fun and games either. For example, the draft. Women should be included if they are truly societal equals to men.

Women are not physical equals to men and are thus less desirable in a combat situation. The few females in the miltary service who are physically equal to men get every ounce of respect they deserve.

And about the potential rapist deal? I'm sorry, but I consider that SMART. Maybe not if you know the person, but even then.... rapes happen. Women in general have to be careful. Are you going to begrudge me that?

Living in fear is not a smart way to live. Living prepared is. I am no more afraid of any man on the street than any person should be afraid of another. Because I'm not a victim. Why are you a victim?

As far as I can see, the Women's Lib movement hardly made a dent in the partriarchal society that MEN run. You know, I'll be happy when there's no glass ceiling. I'll be happy when a woman and a man doing the same job get the same pay. And you know what? I'll be even happier when I don't have to worry about riding the subway or buses alone.

Hardly a dent? Which is why these guys were punished for celebrating their manhood, in a way which was no more vulgar than what the women were doing. If you are skilled and dedicated, there is no glass ceiling. Excell at your job, and don't be passive about getting raises which are fair to your skill, and you will be paid just as much.

You don't want to be worried about doing something alone? Be prepared. It's that simple. Women only become victims when they allow it.

Nobody's calling you inferior. Don't get huffy just because I happen to want the same opportunities as you.

You have every opportunity in the world, if you quit playing the gender card.

And when was the last time we heard of white males being chosen last? (I'm assuming you're white, correct me if i'm wrong).

It's the women and the minorities being chosen last, love. If you think it's not, you're really wrong.

Affirmative action. White males are getting passed over for jobs they're qualified for...to meet minority race and gender quotas.

Men also get picked last in the rights arena. They're rapidly losing theirs. Simple as that.

[nippinout]

Why don't the supporters of Affiramtive Action realize that it is a racist and sexist policy?

"Hi Mrs. Minority. We're going to hire you even though this Aryan man over here is more experienced and more qualified."

You're basically calling the minority stupid.

[Duzzy]

Physical attributes have nothing, and I mean absolutely nothing to do with equality!

They make us different, not inferior or superior, which is why I said that we are equal, but not the same... That would be like me saying that becuase my brain and body are different from yours I am a superior person.

We aren't. We have different brains. We have different bodies.

I also disagree with this, women are physically different, that does not make them inferior. You will see it over and over again where the strongest does not win. It is all about finding your advantages and using them.

And yes, women who serve get every ounce of respect that they earn, the same with men. As much as I would love to repsect them simply because they are women, I won't. I will respect them for signing up, and being the best they can be, because that is repsect that they earned.

Women are not physical equals to men and are thus less desirable in a combat situation. The few females in the miltary service who are physically equal to men get every ounce of respect they deserve.

[tsc]

Physical attributes have nothing, and I mean absolutely nothing to do with equality!

They make us different, not inferior or superior, which is why I said that we are equal, but not the same... That would be like me saying that becuase my brain and body are different from yours I am a superior person.

Women are often not strong enough to do the same jobs as men. Thus, they are not equal. The male and female brains interpet input in different ways, and respond differently to stimuli. Thus, not equal.

I also disagree with this, women are physically different, that does not make them inferior. You will see it over and over again where the strongest does not win. It is all about finding your advantages and using them.

And yes, women who serve get every ounce of respect that they earn, the same with men. As much as I would love to repsect them simply because they are women, I won't. I will respect them for signing up, and being the best they can be, because that is repsect that they earned.

Most women in the service are one hundred percent worthless. They cannot carry a full load, they cannot run for long distances, they cannot shoot well (recoil) and they cannot adequatly develop fighting skills. Respect women soldiers if they are good soldiers. Respect good soldiers. Do not respect women simply for enlisting, it is usually not for altruistic purposes.

[nippinout]

Physical attributes have nothing, and I mean absolutely nothing to do with equality!

They make us different, not inferior or superior, which is why I said that we are equal, but not the same... That would be like me saying that becuase my brain and body are different from yours I am a superior person.

I also disagree with this, women are physically different, that does not make them inferior..

Why are there so many men in construction as opposed to women? Men are more suited for it. Men have much higher testosterone levels. We have testosterone factories. I have muscles not because I lift weight, but because I am male.

[Duzzy]

Women are often not strong enough to do the same jobs as men. Thus, they are not equal. The male and female brains interpet input in different ways, and respond differently to stimuli. Thus, not equal.

I believe that women are fully capable of becoming as strong as men if they chose to, but they don't. Probably because society has deemed that ripped women with beards is not fashionable at this point and time. But that is still a difference, apparently we have a different definition of equality because this is getting no where fast.

Most women in the service are one hundred percent worthless. They cannot carry a full load, they cannot run for long distances, they cannot shoot well (recoil) and they cannot adequatly develop fighting skills. Respect women soldiers if they are good soldiers. Respect good soldiers. Do not respect women simply for enlisting, it is usually not for altruistic purposes.

That is actually what I was getting at. I will respect them if they earn it, and being a good solider and doing what is required, even surpassing that is earning my respect in my book. On the same token I won't respect men who enlist for the sake of enlisting and do not pull their own weight.

Why are there so many men in construction as opposed to women? Men are more suited for it. Men have much higher testosterone levels. We have testosterone factories. I have muscles not because I lift weight, but because I am male.

Once again this is getting no where because we are not agreeing on a consistent definition of equal, what you are calling inequality, I am calling differences. I will atempt to remedy that in a moment.

This is the definition of Equality I am basing my arguements from:
Having the same privileges, status, or rights: equal before the law.

This is the definition I believe you two are using:
Having the requisite qualities, such as strength or ability, for a task or situation.

Which do you want to use?

[Jakedubbleya]

Women dont have to be the same as men to be equals. They they are unequal in most specific aspects, but overall those inequalities i believe balance balance each other out to a complete equality.

The problem with feminism, is it does not wish to recognize that. Feminists do not want to recognize that they are inferior scientists, warriors, and leaders for example. That womens minds and bodies are better suited than the males for things like caretaking, social work, and artistic thought.

I blame this partly on a society that centers everything around posessions. Women feel they must have the indipendence, and purchasing power men have. And it makes sense, problem is, its either crazy women or no more capitolism lol.

------

It was mentioned earlyer that most suppressed societies that eventually rebelled and gained status, became the oppresors themselfs. It would be interesting to see a swap of power from male to female rather than say pagans to christians or monarch to commune.

I dont think it would hold up of course, but i think it would make quite a point wither way.

[billybob_81067]

With equality you take the good with the bad. So I have to put up with you loving your penis (as long as you don't do it in public), and you have to put up with my antics. Got it?

As long as your antics aren't in public!

Edit: Oh and I think V-day (both Valentines day and the V-day related to this thread) and P-day should all be banned cause they're all just plain stupid!



{()} day

8==> day

m day <- supposed to be a heart
----..... \/

[teufelhunden]

I have an appointment to go to, but real quick: Women, it's been found, when comparing apples to apples, make as much or more than men. http://www.jewishworldreview.com/cols/leo031405.asp

Will post more in depth when I return.

[Lohman446]

Is it fair that when taking a test (for employment, and now possibly in standardized testing) that people get

XX points solely for being of a non-aryan race

XX points for not being male

And, if the trend continues

XX points for not being heterosexual (though I still maintain the argument this is not genetic, thats a whole different thread)


It does two things. It makes those who do not get the extra points be discriminated against soley based on genetics - which to me flies in the face of "equal opportunity for all".

Secondly it devalues those who succeed who are not male aryan. It makes the question come up " are you here only because of affirmative action" and devalues the efforts those who succeed have put in. I have seen numerous reports of those who have turned down affirmative action based promotions because they did not want the stigma. Guess what, even when they get promotions after earning them fully, they still get the stigma. As such I have to say affirmative action is basely unfair, both to those who benefit from it and those who do not.

If V-day is allowed, then P-day must be. If one is vulgar than the other must be. Its the base idea of "not the same (seperate) but equal" which I would have thought we would have learned from...

Rather than saying I <3 Vagina what if I took a shirt taht said I l<3 (you can put in the blank anything you want thats less "textbook" than vagina). I think men at the base have to agree with it, at least most... so why object?

[MarkM]

I agree it is political correctness gone mad.
whilst I have views on some things connected with this subject that I will keep private since although I know some will agree some won't and it isn't worth the flames to post those views.

The one thing about all the so called equality issues is that ok lets call everyone equal (ala Animal Farm) and well guess what? You can't have it all ways you either want equality or you don't you can't have some parts and not the others. This applys to special days as well as the rest of the year so this is on topic. Oh and for a little bit of light hearted fun......


God was just about done creating man, but he had two things
left over in his bag and He couldn't decide quite how to split them
between Adam and Eve. He thought He might just as well ask them.
He told them one of the things He had left was a thing that would allow the owner to
pee while standing up. "It's a very handy thing," God told them, "and I was
wondering if either one of you had a preference for it."

Well, Adam jumped up and down and begged, "Oh, please give that
to me! I'd love to be able to do that! It seems like just the sort of thing a
man should have. Please! Pleeease! Give it to me. !" On and on he went
like an excited little boy.
Eve just smiled and told God that if Adam really wanted it so badly, he
could have it.

So God gave Adam the thing that allowed him to pee standing up.
Adam was so excited he just started whizzing all over the place - first
on the side of a rock, then he wrote his name in the sand, and then he
tried to see if he could hit a stump ten feet away - laughing with delight
all the while.

God and Eve watched him with amusement and then God said to
Eve, "Well, I guess you're kind of stuck with the last thing I have left."

What's it called?" asked Eve.

"Brains", said God

[Lohman446]

God was just about done creating man, but he had two things
left over in his bag and He couldn't decide quite how to split them
between Adam and Eve. He thought He might just as well ask them.
He told them one of the things He had left was a thing that would allow the owner to
pee while standing up. "It's a very handy thing," God told them, "and I was
wondering if either one of you had a preference for it."

Well, Adam jumped up and down and begged, "Oh, please give that
to me! I'd love to be able to do that! It seems like just the sort of thing a
man should have. Please! Pleeease! Give it to me. !" On and on he went
like an excited little boy.
Eve just smiled and told God that if Adam really wanted it so badly, he
could have it.

So God gave Adam the thing that allowed him to pee standing up.
Adam was so excited he just started whizzing all over the place - first
on the side of a rock, then he wrote his name in the sand, and then he
tried to see if he could hit a stump ten feet away - laughing with delight
all the while.

God and Eve watched him with amusement and then God said to
Eve, "Well, I guess you're kind of stuck with the last thing I have left."

What's it called?" asked Eve.

"Multiple Orgasms", said God

Corrected to how I heard it
Edit: it didn't violate the cuss filter, so I am guessing its ok and left it, if not then if its removed I understand

[Duzzy]

The one thing about all the so called equality issues is that ok lets call everyone equal (ala Animal Farm) and well guess what? You can't have it all ways you either want equality or you don't you can't have some parts and not the others. This applys to special days as well as the rest of the year so this is on topic.

This is very possible, have everyone equally restricted on "special days" of the year. Make it legal for everyone to take 3 "special" days off without penalty for religous / cultural reasons, if you want to take more days off for "special" time then they have to use vacation time, or sick days, or whatever they call it these days.

Its the base idea of "not the same (seperate) but equal" which I would have thought we would have learned from...

I honestly don't get what you are saying. Is this a good thing? Or a bad thing in your mind?

[Lohman446]

I honestly don't get what you are saying. Is this a good thing? Or a bad thing in your mind?

What i meant is this - if you allow one, you ahve to allow both. That is equality. Men and women are different (duh). Allowing V-day and not P-day (though why either should be allowed I have no clue) illustrates the base, that it is impossible to treat people differently and yet still as equals - at least in what is allowed or given in the legal sense. I don't mean you should treat all women like you do your guy friends, I am more discussing it on a legal (or education, employment - instituional) level

[Duzzy]

That is what I thought you meant, I just wanted to make sure. In that case, bravo.