i was just at the field today, talking to the refs (one of whom is a friend) and another friend. the thing is, my friend has driven me to the field many times this summer, and now that i have my licence i would like to be able to drive him, or at least drive him home. which would be perfectly safe, considering i would be driving him 10 minutes and he wouldnt be distracting me. the law is to prevent a bunch of teenagers from going out partying, and distracting the driver, which i certainly wouldnt do. the thing is, the police in our town arent exactly busy, so they are often really strict regarding rules such as this. in fact, even though our town isnt that busy and is rather small, our police force gives out the most tickets of any town in the area. but anyway, it turns out my friend (the ref) just got pulled over with a friend in his car (his first time driving with a friend) and he has to go to court this coming friday. if he loses, he will lose his licence for 30 days, then have to wait another 6 months to be able to drive a friend. but now on to the real question. i was talking to one of the other refs about it, and he said that there is a new law that was passed (which i heard mention of, but didnt know anything about and didnt know it was passed) that makes it illegal to drive anyone under 18 if you are under 19. does anyone know if this law in fact has been passed, and what it exactly is? or at least where i could find out? also, does anyone know if this law (if it was passed, or the law for waiting 6 months before driving friends if it wasnt passed) is a primary or secondary offence?
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halo B -
Start here:
http://www.mass.gov/legis/laws/mgl/
Usually I would have looked it up for you but I'm tired and I have to work tomorrow early (c:
Cops in Mass suck. If you're a teenager you're and easy target and I've seen cops do some pretty bad things themselves. It doesn't matter if you're guilty or not, they'll make stuff up. "Marked Lanes Violation" is one of thier favorite excuses to harass kids. Anyways, don't give them any reason, they'll screw with you without having to be encouraged
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thanks so much! that was what i was looking for. but now i have to search through a ton of laws and translate from lawyer to english so i can find out what they mean...Originally posted by JaanStart here:
http://www.mass.gov/legis/laws/mgl/
Usually I would have looked it up for you but I'm tired and I have to work tomorrow early (c:
Cops in Mass suck. If you're a teenager you're and easy target and I've seen cops do some pretty bad things themselves. It doesn't matter if you're guilty or not, they'll make stuff up. "Marked Lanes Violation" is one of thier favorite excuses to harass kids. Anyways, don't give them any reason, they'll screw with you without having to be encouraged
so that essentially means that from 1:00 AM to 4:00 AM, until i reach age 18, if i do not have a parent in the car i am legally considered driving unlicenced? and from 12:00 AM to 1:00 AM and 4:00 AM to 5:00 AM i am legally considered driving unlicenced, but can only be pulled over for another offence? (AKA, secondary offence). damn, i wish i knew that before. drivers ed just said you couldnt drive from midnight to 5, nothing that specific. and my sister told me there is a 1 hour waiving period, where the cop will just give you a warning to get home... neither of those are exactly correct. well good thing no one pulled me over for speeding at 4:45 this morning, i doubt if a cop saw me driving at that time with a gun in the passenger seat he'd believe me that i was heading to work... (reffing at canobie in compliance with a sponsorship)Originally posted by MASSlaw
so if i had been pulled over for speeding i would have been considered driving without a licence, even though i had to drive then. wonderful.
...okay i have been looking for about an hour and i still cant find anything on driving friends. and i dont know what to search for, i doubt they would use the term "friends" or "peers" and "persons under the age of" only results with 6 entries. i have looked through all of chapter 90. will someone please help me with this law? i really dont want to ask my parents, there is already too much going on with them in regards to driving.
heh, wow thats funny, aparently its illegal to let a car idle for more than 5 minutes unless you are transporting goods or servicing the vehicle... xvalve, ule body, logic vert frame, WWA barrel
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halo BComment
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See, that's why they have to make up a reason to pull over a teenager.the provisions of this paragraph shall be enforced by law enforcement agencies only when a junior operator of a motor vehicle has been lawfully stopped for a violation of the motor vehicle laws or some other offense.
In the United States the constitution protects ugainst unreasonable search. Since it is legal for a person to operate an automobile *while properly licensed*, then simply operating a motor vehicle is not evidence of a crime. The same applies to something like carying a concealed handgun in Mass. If a cop notices that you're carrying a "piece" he can't legally ask you to produce a licence to carry just based on that alone since you could be legal.
Anyways, in a perfect world you would never be pulled over just for driving while young and any police officer who engaged is such despicable criminal behavior would be severely punished. In the real world though you might be pulled over a lot, and the pi ... eh ... cop will make up some lame excuse and search your car and basically wipe his butt with the American flag. Don't be surprised if you loose a few of your CD's too. At 2am on the side of the road the constitution and all the people who have died and suffered to protect it, doesn't mean a damned thing.
Sorry for the rant, but there are some baaaaaaad guys out there posing as cops, and I don't want to see you get screwed. Just this past week, a cop in my own town got sent to jail for 2 years and that's only because the girl he was trying to force sex from was smart enough to call her friend on her cell phone and record it on voice mail:
http://www.eastbayri.com/story/315423266963629.php
in the town I used to work in, the chief of police and another officer raped an underaged girl in the backseat of a cruiser ... and in you drive through North Attleboro you WILL be pulled over by Ariggi "The Piggy" for Marked Lanes Violation.
So don't screw around and don't expect to have any rights ... meaning, hide your "smokes" or whatever else you have that you don't want to discuss, ALL THE TIME. Those bastards roll up on you fast. Keep stuff down the front of your pants because everything else will be searched. I'm not advocating anything, just being honest. It's disgusting to me that a cop will comit a felony in order to screw some poor kid over a mistermeaner.
PS There are some GREAT cops out there too, seriously. I'm friends with some of them. These are men who take thier jobs seriously and love the Untited States. The thing is, unless you're a bad guy, or (and let's hope you never find this out) are the victim of a crime you'll never meet these guys on the side of the road. The only ones a decent law abiding citizen will meet are the wrong ones.
OKay, end of rant now, I promise.Comment
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thanks. the second one pretty much summed it up without "law" language. so if that is up to date, then it is still just 6 months without friends.Originally posted by Rocp15126
Jaan - i agree with most of what you said. my sister and friends have met some cops like that. my sister was driving with one of her friends once (legally) and was pulled over for going 41 in a 40 zone. when there were people going easily 50. when he pulled her over she saw him looking around the car for anything, and he checked her licence to see if she was still in the 6 month period. he was forced to let her go. again just a few weeks ago she was driving two of her friends and a cop pulled her over for who knows what, some other excuse. he did the same thing except it was night, so he took out a flashlight and flashed it around the car to check for anything. now my sister and i drink this fruit juice/soda that comes in bottles that look exactly like beer bottles... he saw one laying on the floor of the backseat, half under the seat, and told the kid in the backseat to pick it up and hand it to him. he looked at it and read where it said "100% fruit juice!" and just glared back at them and said "damn it i wanted to bust you for something!" in a joking manner... but something tells me he wasnt joking.
my friend i talked to saturday at the field was pulled over his first time ever driving a friend, and hes going to court to challenge it because the cop that pulled him over said she got him on radar going 40 in a 30, when there were two cars inbetween him and the cop car. two cars going the same speed, too. she pulled HIM over specifically because she saw he was young, was wearing his hat backwards, and there was another kid in the side seat.
as for those two stories... thats just horrible. its something i guess that you expect to hear from time to time, but in your own town... that cop should have gotten more than 2 years, and i hope the police chief and other cop got life. nothing less would be acceptable.
im pretty much straightedge and law abiding, ive never done any drugs and dont have anything to hide. ...despite what everyone seems to think considering im a 17 year old guy who has spikey hair, wears sunglasses, and wears all black with baggy pants... i follow almost all the laws, but i believe in following the spirit of the law, not necessarily the letter. i also believe what thoreau said, "the government which governs least governs best" or something to that effect. i know what the law was created for, to keep kids from going out, partying, distracting the driver in a crammed car, and crashing. too many idiots did that, some senator or whatever wanted to get re-elected and win votes from sobbing mothers, and it ruined it for everyone else. i know i can safely drive a friend to the field and back, and i will only use the car for transportation, not partying. we probably wont even talk, and if its a new field it would actually help, because i could keep my eyes on the road while he navigates. if i crash the car (which im pretty certain i wont, i try to drive safely), i would have crashed the car without my friend there. the law has a point, but its completely pointless with my application to driving friends and i want a way around it. the same thing with the restriction from driving from midnight to 5. i had to leave at 4:30 yesterday morning to get to the field on time for reffing a big game. ive had to leave for a tournament at 4 before. if i was pulled over, it would have been treated as if i had been driving without my licence... which i think is at least a $100 fine, and maybe more. now i needed to leave then to get to work. although i doubt a cop would have believed that, considering im a teenager out at 4:30 in the morning with a gun in the passenger seat.Originally posted by Jaan
i cant blame it entirely on the cops and senators either though. i should also blame it on teenagers like the two who passed me on the highway in a jeep, the kid in the side seat leaning out the window and giving me the finger. i would hope that they crash, except it would only mean harsher laws on me.
but while we're on the subject of cops, i do have a story to tell from yesterday. my team was reffing a scenario yesterday, and we were out front with some other guys directing traffic. Noam, the manager of canobie, asked to get a cop there just to keep everyone in line (cause they wont screw around in front of a cop) considering there were maybe 200 people there. the cop showed up late, and the first thing he did was yell at us because he said the place was hard to find. then instead of actually going up to where the people were, he parked at the entrance and started sipping on his coffee coolatta. i can only assume he had finished his donut by then. some guy on a motorcycle came down the street and RAILED on the gas, almost lifted his front wheel up. the cop didnt even put down his drink. after about 10 minutes of him sitting there in his car he left. what a help
a cop WOULD have actually helped, too. woodsball isnt exactly what everyone here makes it up to be. i dont know exactly what happened, (i didnt see it) but from what i heard some guy punched out one of the refs and ran off into the woods before other refs could get there.
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halo BComment
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It doesn't really matter if he's distracting you or not, he's just not supposed to be in the car.
Most people I know just ignore this law and its not enforced very strongly...Comment
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hes not supposed to be in the car... because why? give me one good reason. besides that its the law, and pertaining to me, not the stereotypical teen who goes out in a party with 5 people in the car.Originally posted by Joe
also sudbury cops give out the most tickets of any town in massachusetts, per cop if not just overall the most tickets. and they really watch our highschool closely. and also id say it IS enforced quite a bit, considering what happened to my friend. xvalve, ule body, logic vert frame, WWA barrel
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halo BComment
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Why do you need a reason besides the law?Originally posted by slade
People are bound to get caught here and there, but practically everyone I know openly breaks the law and doesn't get caught.
Maybe it's because there aren't that many cops in my town...meh.Comment
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because the law was designed for safety, and i know that it will not be any less safe driving if i have a friend with me. in fact, it could be safer. i dont see a reason to follow a rule without a valid reason behind it if i can get away with it. the only problem is, that second part could be hard.Originally posted by Joe
oh yeah, one thing that i found funny was that, from what i read at least, the law did not specify that the person in the seat next to you has to be conscious. so you could legally have your parent sleeping in the seat next to you, and have as many friends as you wanted in the car. you could pay a 21 year old hobo with a licence to ride in the seat next to you. how would that make anything safer? xvalve, ule body, logic vert frame, WWA barrel
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halo BComment
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If you can get away with it go ahead. I've already stated that many people do.
Your reason to follow the law is the 30 day permit suspension and the renewed 6 month term. (By the way, 30 days is your first offense, 2nd offense is 60 days, 3rd is 90, 4th is a year and by that time you're 18 anyway)
It doesn't really matter if you think the law is stupid or not, you can't really do anything about it until you can voteComment
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It doesn't really matter who you vote for either ... lol, this is Mass, a blue state (c:Originally posted by Joe
There are so many laws that you're pretty much breaking some kind of law every minute of every day. Think about it.
The only way to "get away" with it is to have friends and connections. I have a few friends in high places, and I'll never ask them to break the law for me, BUT I've asked them a couple of time to make sure everything is done by the book. Isn't that sad, that you have to have "juice" just to be treated the way you're supposed to be treated
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i know what the punishments are. and i most likely will follow it. im just saying that there is no valid point in me following it, its only an inconvenience.Originally posted by Joe xvalve, ule body, logic vert frame, WWA barrel
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halo BComment
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you can be doing everything correctly. hands at 10 and 2, or they teach 9 and 3 now; doing the speed limit, not even the 5 "spirit of the law" over; car in perfect working order, no broken headlights, tail lights, or turn signals; and still be pulled over for some made up excuse.
it was 3.30 in the morning. i was comming home from a friend' house. the road is kinda curvy. and at the end is straights, speed limit is 35 the whole time. i'm doing 35 and when i get to the last bend i see a cop that was going the opposite direction do a 3 point turn on the road and then pull up behind me. didn't have the lights, sirens, anything on. i kept driving. after a quarter mile he finally turns on the lights. i pull into the lot of a store that is right there. park the car. dude walks up, starts asking question. "liscene, insurance,....etc" i notice another car pull up.by the end there were 6 cop cars in the lot with me. they used the excuse "I was in the area of a robbery" to pull me over and try to find something to either ticket me or jail me. one of the cops who was giveing me attitude the whole time was just about to have me exit the vechile and probalby try and get me to fail a field sobriety test when the first cop who was nice said ok, everthings fine, go ahead. i had to wait for all the cars to move before i could pull out of the lot. first off, except for certain reasons, more than 2 cop cars should suffice. now i'm talking about trying to run, people who could be a danger to the cops or others, but to someone who did nothing wrong, was answering all of the questions, and just trying to be helpful, is the nessesary? no. we really need people to realize that the lawmakers work for them, and need to pass laws that will acctually help people and not just TRY!!! to save some lives.
i can see if it's 430 in the morning and the punk kid driving to work and gets pulled over. now if the kid is helpful in explaining why he's out that early and not being mean and all "wtf man, why am i being pulled over? this is bull." he shouldn't try and find something else to ticket the boy for? now if the same person is kinda weaving over the road, speeding, and underage, by all means, pull the kid over. i wish cops would realize if they have to try and find something wrong the person should be let go.e-mag 226
flashed with 1.31Comment
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Well, you have to understand, these guys have to try to justify thier paychecks ... so teenagers are easy marks, especially if it's obvious they can't aford $30,000 for a good lawyer. Another thing is that it costs a LOT of money to go after an actual criminal, where as teenagers are good for a few bucks, either in court costs or tickets or what have you. And bad guys are freaking DANGEROUS man ... a cop could get hurt going after bad guys. There are quite a few cops out there who are the same cowardly bully's we knew in school. Next time you get pulled over keep that in mind, that this is just a coward with a tiny little "night stick" and you'll start to understand his behavior. The plus side is that if you know this, many cops are easy to manipulate
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