Let's say I break into your house....

[iambored]

Someone mentioned illegals wanting rights? In America? I'm sorry, but in America only legal citizens have rights. (At least that's what I remember from that Bill of Rights lesson in school)
Put up fences and let the border patrol shoot people. See how long people want to illegally enter the country when there are guards shooting at them when they come to close to certain sections of the wall.

[Lohman446]

It's not a country club but its further not a public lake. If you want to come here there is the right way and the wrong way. Doing it the wrong way should be punished. Since we've been letting it go for so damned long, I wouldn't have a problem with just locking down the borders for a period to sort things out and get the proper systems in place. Seems like it's making the problem more difficult by letting people continue to flow in while we're trying to secure that very process.

I'm all for fences.
I'm all for armed border agents who are allowed to actually use their weapons.
I'd support legislation making the penalties for illegally entering our country much stiffer, and enforcing enforcement.
etc.

Not anti-immigrant, anti-illegal immigrant. I work too hard and pay too much money to the government to let some system skirting, resource abusing illegal reap the benefits.

This country used to be a melting pot of ideas, cultures, etc. We are distinctly American-- our ancestors came here to become Americans. To steal someone else's words, these illegals are not coming here to join the melting pot. They're here to make a tossed salad; they have no desire to become an American, just to be a Mexican/Salvadoran/Dominican in America -- sending American dollars out of America.

I agree the borders need to be secured.

However, you would shoot someone who's only goal (or crime) is to try to make a better life for themselves?

Yes, coming here illegally is wrong, and needs dealt with. So is speeding. I would commit crimes to keep my child from starving... so I guess I have to look at the people who would come here illegally with a bit of empathy.

I am thankful every year I was born here and don't have to make these decisions.

[Lohman446]

They don't pay taxes (hardly)

Source that? Isn't part of the fault companies for not taking withholdings?

And I think you should consider that at least some illegals do pay taxes. How I have no clue, but I have seen it sited before.

[skife]

i'm all about immigration legally. i was actually talking to this cuban girl that sits behind me in a college class, she came here legally and will be a citizen in a few months.

If your going to come here though, at least learn to communicate with people from here.
come here to better yourself, don't send money back to the homeland.

honestly though, if they want to come here legally and better THEMSELVS, go right ahead.
but don't come here, tresspass, jump the fence, and not pay taxes or even have any government know you exist here and then leach off of our resources and then take what you have earned and not paied taxes on.

maybe let legal immigration be easier?

[robnix]

maybe let legal immigration be easier?

I asked a rabbi once why Jews didn't try to convert people and why it was so difficult fpr someone to convert. He told me it was because we wanted people that were converting for the right reasons, that it was important to be sure that they really wanted to convert.

Make immigration cheap, but keep it difficult.

[Pneumagger]

maybe let legal immigration be easier?

I don't see how it could be easier than sneaking across the border at night and thumbing your way up the interstate till you find trabajo. Heck, until you get 3-4 states away from the border, EVERYTHING is bilingual like it's some sort of requirement to provide Spanish communication in an English country out of our pockets for people (supposedly) without rights.

What is the Republican stance on this issue?

[Babylon 5]

But why build a fence when a mine field is so much cheaper?

I saw on the local news where they were having a debate between the to sides on this issue and the pro amensty person for all illegals used in her deffence "Europe has same amout of undocumented citizens as the US with about 12 million." Am I the only one who finds it funny that she lob a whole continet together and compares it to the US which is a lone country. If anything it just proves how serve of a problem we have.

But honestly what needs to be done is build the fence and then find out the best way incorprate the "undocumented citizens" into the country. Cause lets face it tracking down the 12 million "undocumented citizens" is not really fesiable or cost effective. While doing all of the above enforce the current laws of imigration.

Also so everyone knows being here "illegally" in the US is not a criminal offence so the only action of punishing the "undocumented citizens" that come in after the fence has be errected is deportation.

[teufelhunden]

I agree the borders need to be secured.

However, you would shoot someone who's only goal (or crime) is to try to make a better life for themselves?

Yes, coming here illegally is wrong, and needs dealt with. So is speeding. I would commit crimes to keep my child from starving... so I guess I have to look at the people who would come here illegally with a bit of empathy.

I am thankful every year I was born here and don't have to make these decisions.

I don't really think shooting everybody coming over illegally is what anybody is proposing; but if those who were crossing were aware there was a legitimate risk of facing armed opposition to their crossing they might think twice.

The simplest solution to keeping your child in clothes is to take steps beforehand to ensure your continued ability to support those whom you [generally] willingly bring into this world. It's like going to the ghetto and seeing women with 7 kids and no jobs. wtf.

The entire immigration issue is really broken down into two parts, yet they converge into one. First, is security. Keeping this country tough to illegally enter will force those looking to do us harm to try and come in through the proper channels, forcing them to face more scrutiny on their way in. Secondly, it's about continued future economic stability for the lower and lower middle classes, which obviously supports the higher socioeconomic classes. However, when you look at the idea of securing the border, that solves both problems.

Amnesty [or some let's-not-say-it-is-but-we-all-know-it-is thing] isn't the solution. One of the most foolish arguments I've heard from republicans [NOT conservatives] on this issue is how much it would cost to find and remove the majority of those living here illegally. That completely flies in the face of the just-below-the-surface idea of small government; we generally feel that government spending should be kept to a minimum -except- in areas of defense and security. Fools.

And, of course, there are those that swim over and work hard, try to Americanize themselves, learn the language, pay their taxes, etc. However, just like everywhere else in life, the bad apples ruin the whole bushel.

[Raven001]

I say let em in... but for God's sake, quit throwing money at 'em.

They don't pay taxes (hardly) or insurance, medical, blah blah blah. The US is currently making it very attractive to illegally immigrate, especially when deporting people. You know why they come over here and work for crappy salaries? Because they know they don't have to foot the bill of LIVING or SUPPORTING THEIR FAMILIES. Kinda like when you were 15 and working at McDonalds living off your parents... $400/disposable income per week is a helluva deal.

Personally, if had to choose to between being myself, going to college and making $60000 a year and paying for myself in the world -=versus=- making $400 a week landscaping and haveing Uncle Sam pay my Living Expenses I might just take the $400 week job.

So where do I stand? (TLDR):
No need to waste money on a fence or more stringent border protection. Just stop giving them money and crack down on illegal employment HARD. Make it harder for them to survive here than Mexico. They're not dumb, they'll figure it out.

[Lohman446]

I don't really think shooting everybody coming over illegally is what anybody is proposing; but if those who were crossing were aware there was a legitimate risk of facing armed opposition to their crossing they might think twice.

Border agents are armed...

Judging by the amount of people who die trying to do it every year I'm not sure it is as easy as some think it is to cross. Could be wrong.

[ahellers]

I hear all this talk about fences, please tell me im not the only one who knows how to jump a fence.

t

[MaD_SaM]

[Tac-OneFun]

gj Mad Sam.... lets take 5 steps back to review what happened in the past and noone could possibly change. what a great use of time.

using your argument... perhaps the Indians should have been more aggresive in keeping us out. Then they wouldn't have been overrun and slaughtered.

Therefore, we should be more aggressive in keeping the Illegal Immigrants out so they dont overrun our country.

Wow, thanks... your logic just helped my view on Illegal Immigration. Sucks when your arguments backfire eh?

[Lohman446]

gj Mad Sam.... lets take 5 steps back to review what happened in the past and noone could possibly change. what a great use of time.

using your argument... perhaps the Indians should have been more aggresive in keeping us out. Then they wouldn't have been overrun and slaughtered.

Therefore, we should be more aggressive in keeping the Illegal Immigrants out so they dont overrun our country.

Wow, thanks... your logic just helped my view on Illegal Immigration. Sucks when your arguments backfire eh?

Sucks when you have zero ability to understand there may be another side of an issue

[Tac-OneFun]

Sucks when you have zero ability to understand there may be another side of an issue

why would i care about the other side of the issue? Illegal Immigrants are criminals and not legal US citizens. They, therefore, should not have a say or argument for their cause.

Would you side with a child molester arguing for NAMBLA? Would you side with a murderer arguing for the abolishment of the death penalty?