** Official Level 10 Problems Thread **

[SeigneurDeVoodoo]

Ok I put in about 800psi into the gun and setup my mag according to the instructions but my bolt won't move when I fire the gun. When I put in a loose carrier it leaks like the instructions said and when I hold down the trigger it stops....i've messed with the springs and made sure the carrier wasn't too tight...it just won't fire the bolt whats going on?!



-Voodoo

[Arturus]

No expert on this, but have you tried turning up the velocity?

I believe many have had to turn their velocity up, more so than normal, for the marker to fire with the lvl 10 kit.

[SeigneurDeVoodoo]

Well I took apart my gun and looked at what might have caused it...and well...let me just say that the only main spring that worked in my kit was the small one that came attached to the bolt...after I had my gun shooting at 280...the other two main springs wouldn't fire. I can't really say how I fixed my problem..but it wasn't velocity, I had it way up. After putting oil in it, made sure the carrier O-ring fit properly and tossed in two shims it started to barely more forward...I then cranked my velocity back up and it started shooting..but I think the bolt could be tuned to be slightly lighter on paint. What the problem may have been was just stupidity on my part and I had one of the grey main springs on in the first place.

[LittMag]

Help! maybe I'm just missing something

I'm using:
Classic Mag/ Classic body
CO2

Setup:
1.5 carrier 3 shims
SHORTEST (brass) spring

Problem:
Basically the gun would fire, then stop firing. Sometimes when it didn't fire, it would make the ball pinching sound then reset, sometimes the bolt would just not fire at all.
At the crono I was very inconsistent (but probably because of the cool temps and CO2) However when it warmed up during the day, I would crono around 310-320, turn it down, crono at 285 (the field limit). I would fire one or a string of a few, then the bolt wouldn't fire. During one game, the gun would just not fire.

I'm using the shortest spring, and I believe that the velocity issue was supposed to be solved by spring length... what should I do?!?

AGD: Go with the biggest carrier that doesn't leak. Try that.

***EDIT*** 7/26/02
1.5 carrier is the largest carrier that doesn't leak, carrier 2 and 2.5 leak. Any other suggestions? If I can't get it to work, would it be possible to send it into AGD for some work? (I would expect to pay for this)

[demonguy8]

lvl 10 woes

sigh i finally get my lvl 10 in and i cant seem get it to work correctly...

alright im using an rtpro input pressure @950 (if that makes a difference)


Following the instructions on the site I started with the carrier with 2 grooves on it and no dots.. LEAKED HEAVILY from barrel.. (im talking a 100 psi/a sec).. assuming it was the described barrel leak i upped the velocity hoping it would stop. It actually seemed to get worse right up until the point wher air came out of the back of the gun..
now down to 2500 psi .. i figured it was the wrong carrier... same situation now 2200 psi... went to the 1.5 carrier which very snug on the back of the bolt and got same result yay 1800psi... convinced now that it wasnt the carrier but either the spring and/or shims i began to try diffferent combinations to no avail... i put back in the non lvl 10 componants just to make sure it was the kit and not my gun and my gun worked as normal...
*note i did the thing where you install the lvl10 with no shims and push on the bolt face while its leaking to hear if it changes tone.. and it didnt change at all

So basicaly facts are:
pretty sure I have the carrier picked right (the one wiht one solid line and no dots)

Heavy venting from barrel..... about 100 psi a sec..

No change in springs or increase in velocity made the leak stop or even slow (unless you count when the velocity went up enought to make it vent out back of gun instead of front

gun works fine with Non lvl 10 parts...

ANY SUGGESTIONS AS TO WHAT I COULD BE DOING WRONG OR WHAT THE PROBLEM IS WOULD BE GREATLY APRECIATED
thanks in advance

*P.S. I watched the video and did the install right,does the AGD tech dept take walk in appointments since I live not even 30 min away?

AGD: Good possibility your bolt pin is not pushed all the way in. There is a big problem, call the office and see if you can come in sometime next week. We can look at it.

[sonicnofadz]

level10

Ummm...this is going to sound really weird but my superbolt doesn't even fit into the body. I have the regular longnose bolt for my micromag RT (yes its a micromag body) and a ANS venturi foami, they both fit fine. When I tried putting the superbolt in, you could visibly see the bolt not being able to fit inside the breach area inside the body (where the tube gets smaller to fit the bolt inside the breech). Upon inspecting the superbolt for any deformations I saw that the tip of the bolt appeared "rounded" and had a larger diameter than the rest of the bolt which has caused me to believe this is why it cannot fit inside the breech's inner diameter. Has anyone else ever seen this? I thought to myself that maybe the Micromag's bore size might have been different but then again the AGD longnose bolt fits like a glove...Im not sure what I should do, the bolt doesn't fit. Has anyone else see superbolts with the tips of them slightly swollen or rounded?


edit: ok I just took a piece of emory cloth and rounded off the front edge of the bolt...after I could finally put the bolt in properly the level 10 kit was pretty easy to install...had a few leaks at first but then I just changed the carrier to a tighter fit and it stopped. The level ten works like a dream. I have no problems with bolt stick. No problems with leaking. No problems with velocity. My micromag rt is officially my main gun now. I tried to break paint, used some non brand name crappy field paint...fanned the trigger, shot sideways, turnned the hopper off...shot a half case...not even a barrel break. I used the smallest bolt spring, (lengthwise) and the number 2 carrier(two stripes)

AGD: This happens occasionally when the washer inside the mainbody develops a burr. You need to take a round file and carefully file off the inside edge of the washer.

[squidboy69]

Still having a problem

Ok, I'm still having a bit of problem with my LX.

If any of you recall, I had to find a shorter spring (shorter than the stock one actually). I ended up finding a spring that *just* reached the end of the LX bolt. The gun fires now, without venting out the AIR, however it seems to chop occasionally(sp?). I'm using 1.5 carrier, and I currently have 3 shims (trying to get it to vent sooner)... It'll still leave a good dent in a pencil. Seems it'll bounce two or three times, then *pow* it'll cycle all the way.

Any ideas? it's hard to show off this way

AGD: Squid give me all the details of your setup in a new post at the bottom so I see it.

[Havoc_online]

I don't know and didnt read about your old problem but the longer the spring, the more pressure on the bolt to slow it down(hence the softer on paint).

[squidboy69]

with the longer springs I was having to turn the velocity up so high it was venting out the back of the AIR

[Havoc_online]

have you tried to use a 2.0 carrier?if it does not leak with a 2.0 the bolt can slide easier so you would not have to turn up the velocity as high and you will be able to use a longer spring.(just an idea)

[emile518]

Using a Classic AIR P/F I ended up using 2 shims and the 1.0 carrier as the 1.5 I was using started to leak after about 1,000 - 1,500 shots. I had to replace the regulator piston because it was an old one from around 1994 and it would vent when the velocity was anywhere near 250 fps using any spring. The problem is even after I replaced the reg piston the velocity must be turned almost all the way up to reach 300 fps. I even replaced the regulator seat. There is little veloctiy adjustment available. I am using the longest spring which is extremely easy on the finger during testing and wish to keep this setup, I just hope my velocity can stay close enough to 300 fps without venting. If anyone could advise if using the 1.0 carrier instead of the looser 1.5 carrier would cause more friction and thus reduced velocity? If that is the case I could try to use the 1.5 carrier with a new O-Ring as maybe the old one leaked because it was damaged when I pulled the carrier out of the power tube during tuning.

[hitech]

Re: Still having a problem

Originally posted by squidboy69
Ok, I'm still having a bit of problem with my LX.

What does it chrono at?

[LittMag]

about my problem above

1.5 carrier is the largest carrier that doesn't leak, carrier 2 and 2.5 leak. Any other suggestions? If I can't get it to work, would it be possible to send it into AGD for some work? (I would expect to pay for this)

AGD: call the tech line.

[ben_JD]

Re: problem with solution

Originally posted by Panzerr
I found that after putting two cases of paint through my new Level 10 kit that i developed a very slight leak in the power tube from time to time. I removed the o-ring carrier and installed the next smallest size and the leak stopped. Apparently the o-ring "broke in" and was a tiny bit too loose.

Is this the appropriate action to take? I noticed today (after about 1 1/2 to 2 cases of paint with Level 10) that I would get a slight leak between shots occasionally. Sometimes shooting the marker would stop the leak, sometimes it wouldn't. I am currently using the 2.0 carrier. From what I read around here, the 1.5 carrier would be my next move?

Also, I am having horrendous efficiency. I shot 600 rounds in a game today and it ate entirely through 68*3000 of HPA.

AGD: If you are leaking only occasionally I would leave it alone because this means you have the least friction on the oring. Reports coming back seem to indicate that using the longest spring gets the worst effciency. Is that what your using?

ben_JD's response to AGD: I am using the middle spring. It leaks only occasionally, but I fear that the leak is what is really impacting my efficiency (roughly 280 fps). Before you posted this response, I added a shim (now up to two) and the leaking seemed to abate. Is this just coincidence, or might that be the answer?

I was using the middle spring, but that still hurt my pinky when I demonstrated the new Level 10 to the folks at the field, so I moved to the longest spring. I will move back to the middle spring, because I am having no problem with chopping. I may even move to the lightest spring, but don't want the bolt to have too much force.

AGD: You should not use your pinky when demoing the marker. Remember, the second half of the forward stroke is under full pressure and will hurt more. Use one of your FAT fingers

[Moats]

My emag in manual mode worked fine before level ten, but not the sear pin/rod will not come out after a couple shots. It will stick back and after a couple seconds you will hear air flow and it will come bakc out. How can i correct this? Is it velocity, preasure, ect...

Thanks

AGD: Add a shim or two