Offical LVL10, Reports from the Field Thread

**BlackVCG** · 06-22-2002, 01:08 PM

Do not post in this thread unless you're reporting results from testing LVL 10.

Things we'll be looking for:

-How long it took you to get it installed and what your configuration was to get it working properly

-The type of gun you're using it on

-Efficiency

-Number of breaks/chops and type of paint used

-Any problems you encountered

-Other general comments

**the123** · 06-22-2002, 07:19 PM

-How long it took you to get it installed and what your configuration was to get it working properly

It took around 15 minutes to setup.

-The type of gun you're using it on

E-mag #00601

-Efficiency

Seemed to be around the same maybe a little LESS efficient.
(flatline tank pressure guage was wrong)

-Number of breaks/chops and type of paint used

0 chops 0 breaks Nelson Anarchy Paint. Over 6,500 rounds run through the marker on Fri + Sat.

-Any problems you encountered

OCCASIONAL tiny leak down barrel that went away when I 'hit' the side of the mainbody near the bolt.

THIS GUN IS SWEET!!!!!!!!!!

**Scooter/Cootie** · 06-22-2002, 09:20 PM

-How long it took you to get it installed and what your configuration was to get it working properly
The guys from Pride that went to the factory to get their lvl 10's installed spent about 3 hours fine tuning everything. This was before Tom had the "tweeners" so we had to go thru about 7 carrier o-rings each to find the right fit. Once we had the parts down, I'm able to install the kit within 5 min.

One thing you will have to keep in mind is that you will need to have your output pressure from your tank set to approx 800psi and you may have to crank your velocity nut up much further than you had it set at using the old internals. I found that since my tank was set at initally 600psi output, it was starving the gun when I rapid fired. Easily fixed.

-The type of gun you're using it on
E-mag w/ Warp + 12volt Revy. 4500psi 68cu Flatline

-Efficiency
I'd have to agree with the123 on the efficiency. It seems that the gun is a little less efficient but this is not very noticable, perhaps a loss of 100 - 200 psi overall.

-Number of breaks/chops and type of paint used
I played today at Paintball Sam's scenario game and I had 2 breaks down the barrel, no chops with about 1000rds shot. This was using Diablo Blaze that had a pretty thick shell. It was roughly 3+ bounce paint.

-Any problems you encountered
One of the issues that I had was that when the barrel would flex, (ie. resting your barrel on top of a chrono), I would get a small leak down the barrel. This was fixed by replacing the o-ring in the carrier to another with a tighter fit and replacing the barrel o-rings.

-Other general comments
All in all, I am amazed with the way that the lvl 10 worked today. I managed to place my gun in weird positions that I knew would chop a ball using the old internals (ie. all the way on its side), only now to hear a "pssst" whenever the bolt caught on a ball.

Using an E-mag in combination with a warp and the lvl 10 upgrade is definately going to give any player an advantage over their competition.

**nerobro** · 06-23-2002, 02:40 AM

It took me aproxamately 1/2 hour from start to finish to get the level 10 running, and working well.

the level 10 was installed ina 1995 micromag 2, running a PVI maxflow, shredder, and an oldschool lapco barrel.

I didn't get any efficancy numbers...

As for chops... I did manage to get the gun to fire 2 balls at once a time or two due to short stroking... but that's it. not a broken ball in the 500 I shot tonight. Half the paint was paint from blitz... tough paint. The other half was Polar ice that didn't get the last step done to it so it was disgustingly fragile. it would crack from a 4-6' drop.

There has to be a better way to get the o-ring carriers out of the gun. At least in my AIR they stick in there REALLY REALLY well...

Update: I took the micromag to badlandz this weekend (the 14th) And I handed my micromag to a newbie for the day. As if it's a change :-) the only thing that was dirty was the OUTSIDE of the mag. So that puts another 1000 rounds through the level 10. this time chronyed at 290. medium spring too :-)

**the123** · 06-23-2002, 05:09 PM

-How long it took you to get it installed and what your configuration was to get it working properly

About 20 minutes.

-The type of gun you're using it on

Automag #CF02704 AGD double trigger, Halo-B on top

-Efficiency

I could get at least 4 pods and a hopper with a 45/4500psi tank. Same as before.

-Number of breaks/chops and type of paint used

0 chops 0 breaks, 1500 balls shot, Nelson Challenger paint

-Any problems you encountered

I short stroked 1 time and had 2 balls come out. No biggie.

-Other general comments

I feel special being on the field without a squeegie.
Less weight to hold me down

**SteveD** · 06-24-2002, 10:23 AM

It took about 10-15 minutes to get it installed and running properly in my E-Mag on Saturday. I had to work the booth all day so I didn't get the chance to put it to the test 'til Sunday.

I couldn't comment, yet, on the efficiency but I was throwing tubes of paint in the ice chest to get the paint as brittle as possible and then hammered on it to TRY to pinch some paint. That's hard to do with a Warp but I managed a few with NO ball breaks. This gun just rocks.

Steve D
AGD Lions

**manike** · 06-25-2002, 10:29 AM

Wow! I just spent the last three days at AGDE going through some milling stuff and fine tuning the new C&C's (saw the first production intent anno'd one BTW and it looks stunning!)

Anyway some beta test level 10 kits arrived on Monday Morning and I got the first one out of the box (my arms are longer than Johns's and anyway he was slow from having been up until 4.00m running test files on the mill)

John installed it on my old original RT (with vert feed body) and with a stock CF grip frame (I'll put my sprung loaded trigger frame onto it at some point...

). It took him about 20-25 minutes because he wouldn't RTFM and because too many cooks were trying to get their hands on the parts

(John Bonich was over also)

I think he tried 3 different carriers and two bolt springs (used the stock one by mistake to start with) before getting it up and running properly. Ended up with the longest spring and it was shooting at just under 300fps.

No idea on the efficiency because we were low on air. It definitely runs out of power more abruptly though. You don't seem to get as much shootdown when using the gun as it runs out of air. It's all seems ok, and then suddenly you are out of air and don't get any more shots.

So onto the shooting test (s). We were using some very brittle paint which would break first time from waist high. The gun shot it fine when used normally, so the hopper was turned off and I tried to shoot as fast as possible while tilting the gun from 90 degrees on one side over to 90 on the other. It shot several hoppers of the paint without a break. It must have stopped on about 20 balls at least and you hear a little 'pst' sound but it makes little difference to your rhythm when you keep firing. Sometimes when a ball is pinched it would then double load but fire both out cleanly on the next shot. (a small price to pay!)

My Vert feed RT is a very early prototype body and it has a vent hole on the side where you can look into the feed tube and breech. I could hold the gun on it's side, roll a ball half way into the breech and then pull the trigger

Usually resulting in soup with any paint... not this time. I would pull the trigger 3-4 times resulting in several pinches before the ball would be pulled in and fired straight out without breaking! And this with paint that would break first time when dropped from waist height...

So onto some even more brittle paint... This would break first time from knee height! same test with hopper turned off and tilting the gun on it's side. Again lots of nice 'pst' noises and no chops! We put several hoppers through of this paint until I finally managed to get a chop, It was after pinching probably 20-30 of the balls that I found one fragile enough to break.

So we wondered how some other guns would fair shooting the same paint? Out comes a Sov II and my Spearhead Autococker, both set up to be as gentle on paint as possible. They would both shoot loaded balls fine but when tilting the gun over and purposely causing misfeeds the Autococker got out about 5 shots before chopping a ball. The Sov was shooting it fine but as soon as a ball didn't feed it made one hell of a mess!

When taking the hopper off the Sov some paint fell from about 4 feet onto the grass... and broke! We put the remainder through the RT with quite a few 'pst's but no breaks!!!

Ok, so now we were scouring around for some very brittle paint. All the old crap and rubbish that we could find... and then John put it into the freezer

A few hours later we took it out to see how brittle it was (it was freezing my fingers). A ball dropped from waist high, broke first time, A ball from knee high broke first time, a ball from 1 foot broke first time and a ball dropped from 6"! broke first time! In fact all balls would break from just over a foot. If it didn't break on the first contact, on the second smaller bounce back up it would... So into the gun it goes and I let lose. The RT is shooting it all fine so we try and force misfeeds. The now familiar 'pst' was heard

but then we did eventually chop one. I laid the gun on it's side and tried misfeeding balls one at a time, it would stop on 2/3 balls that would otherwise break when being dropped from less than a foot!

You should have seen the grins on our faces! John had to almost restrain me from emptying the rest of his paint store through my RT!

For the next 'scientific test' I sacrificed my finger to science. To get an idea of the bolt force in the different guns. I must admit I was suprised by how much force the RT still had on my finger, it was more than I was expecting but not enough to hurt. And then I put my finger in the Sov II, which had significantly more force than the RT now! My cocker, which will normally stop on Hellfire paint also had significantly more force than the RT. (my cocker is normally comparable to a matrix with trinity mod). WOW!

So anyway I want to check what velocity we are getting, so we take an e-mag with the kit over to the chrono... first shot was 299 and John goes to turn away happy that we were at tourny velocity levels, and I'm like 'no fire some more' second shot was 299... and john goes to turn away before I complain again, he turns back and the third shot is 300fps! I was simply stunned.

We must have shot at least 4 cases through this gun, trying to chop the whole way!

All in all a great day and my RT has a whole new lease of life. Can't wait to put an Iframe on it and start handing it out for others to try. Any Europeans who want can try and find me in Toulouse and you can use it for yourselves!

problems encountered? They wouldn't give me enough kits for all my guns and all my friends that have mags

Oh and we also put it to use in conjunction with the eye on an Extreme. This is the ultimate combination in my opinion, no breaks and no 'psts'. Just one long stream of extremely brittle paint... Can't wait to get my gun, some hellfire and go play a tournament!

manike

p.s. the manik-e-magbody got machined on Monday also and boy does it look better in real life than the virtual image. No piccies till it's annodised and finished though

The body now weighs 5.5oz It started off at 11.25!

Boy was that a long post! Shartley eat your heart out

**JanStah** · 06-25-2002, 12:28 PM

I got my LX today too! (Thanks Manike!)

I think I'm the first one who's posted who's actually putting it on an old (REALLY OLD) PF Mag instead of an emag/RT/Pro.
Edit: NeroBro put his on a Micromag, but I'm still sure this is the oldest mag so far... (SN: ProMag0271)

I have air & paint to try, but no chrony. Hmmm. That'll have to wait until sunday!

We managed to get the LX mod installed in about 20 mins. We used the 2-stripe o-ring carrier, the biggest mainspring and 2 shims.

Some things we noticed from dry-firing...

1. The trigger pull seems a little harder than before.

2. It seems a little less efficient, although I only had about 1.2k in my dive bottle to test on... enough for maybe 100 or so shots on a 0.9l tank.

3. We still get the odd little hissing leak when there's no pressure left in the tank.

We dont know the velocity 'cause we dont have a chrono (and also 'cause jon forgot to bring some barrels!), but it feels like it kicks the same as before.

We tried the 'Dollar bill' test but it's a little hard with a powerfeed.

We also tried the 'Dangle-ball' test, and it worked flawlessly; didnt break a single ball.

So Far, so good.

More after we try it on-field this sunday.

Jan.

**Troy** · 06-27-2002, 09:39 AM

-30 min to install in emag/warp

-1.5 carrier and middle bolt spring

-efficiency seems to be the same

-shot 3/4 of a case of blaze, 0 chops. The paint was not very brittle but I shot the gun gangsta style the whole time. This kind of shooting would have chopped all kinds paint with the old setup.

-I had the same prob with the barrel that Scooter had

-This thing is awesome. I cannot wait to shoot some brittle paint with this thing.

**Timmy63** · 06-27-2002, 08:11 PM

30min. install in my e-mag
10min. in my RT

Once you know what you're doing it goes pretty quick.

Efficency- Maybee a little less but nothing to complain about.

Breakage- Nothing in the e-mag after about 1000rnds I was at Sam's on Sunday with Steve and put some blaze on ice for an hour and shot it through my e-mag with a revy on top (no warp) and it still shot fine. I have 500rnds through my RT and since I haven't shot it in a while I short-stroked the crap out of it and still couln't break anything.

I love the Lv10. It is simply unbelievable!!!

**marc** · 06-27-2002, 10:05 PM

-How long it took you to get it installed and what your configuration was to get it working properly
3 hours (including on field to adjust the velocity)

-The type of gun you're using it on
E-mag with warped feed
-Efficiency
estimating less (look in general comments)
-Number of breaks/chops and type of paint used
0 chops of 1000
-Any problems you encountered
changing velocity and others (look in general comments)
-Other general comments
When got to the field i realized that i forgot my sear pin, so i invented something that worked. I had to rent a tank (with a broken guage) and when it was filled they filled it differently every time, so i dont know for sure if it is less efficiant, but it felt like it was. I had my power feed missadjusted so i had to push each ball in and many balls got stuck between the breach, BUT NO BREAKS.

__________________

**complicationjack** · 06-29-2002, 03:22 PM

level10

-How long it took you to get it installed and what your configuration was to get it working properly

20 minutes total - 1.5 carrier, 2 shims, and the long spring

-The type of gun you're using it on

Minimag

-Efficiency

less

-Number of breaks/chops and type of paint used

0 chops, 0 breaks, marballizer

-Any problems you encountered

No problems, except maybe the fact that you have almost no warning (besides obviously the gauge) when you run out of air...it just stops...

**Bwaites** · 06-29-2002, 05:01 PM

Level 10 is SOOOO Cool! Just installed it in my sons Classic Mag. I have a Superbolt in my Emag, so I wanted to hold on to it until I saw how Level 10 worked. Besides I haven't chopped or broke a ball in my Emag since I got my HALO B back.

-How long it took you to get it installed and what your configuration was to get it working properly.
45 minutes with an additional 10 to set velocity. Carrier is 1.5 with the longest spring. 2 shims.

-The type of gun you're using it on.
Classic Mag, Dye double trigger grip, Flatline 68/3000, Armson Stealth barrel.

-Efficiency.
Slightly less, I used to get 7-800 balls per fill, got just about 650, but I had some dry shots while setting velocity, so only slightly less.

-Number of breaks/chops and type of paint used.
Couldn't get it to chop or break paint down the barrel, including turning the Revy off and shooting as fast as I can. (Maybe 7-8 BPS) AllStar Advantage paint.

-Any problems you encountered.
Pay very close attention to the shims when you install the tip. I used the Level 10 for dummies version instructions, and slightly tilted the valve, one shim slid in the way and got bent, this took me a little while to figure out, so I think I can install the next one in 10 minutes, and then set velocity.

-Other general comments

Suggestion, make the shims a little bigger diameter so they can't slide in the way. Include a few more shims of the current size until they can be resized. Just for the BETA versions. The Street versions need to have the bigger diameter versions.

Finally: WOW, Tom you are a genius!!

Input Pressure: 800 PSI

Bill

**Pand0ra** · 06-30-2002, 03:11 PM

-How long it took you to get it installed and what your configuration was to get it working properly

Donno, done by AGD-E on my Emag C&C.

-The type of gun you're using it on

Emag Extreme C&C + ACE + LVL10

-Efficiency

Slightly lower, very slighly.

-Number of breaks/chops and type of paint used

0, nada. Test done with very old paint (Tornado), Severe and the latest Zap Chronic. Paints were 3-4 bounces before break, and 0 bounce comming from the freezer for one of the test hehe.

I shot around 2000 balls.
The real test will be Toulouse, of course.

EDIT: Over the 5 cases of paint shot at Toulouse, no shop, even with the battery dead on my revo

, and that was with the ACE disabled.

-Any problems you encountered

Not the smalest one.
I tend to go with the comment of Manike about the shootdown just before you run out of air. With the mod 10 it seems the marker works perfectly, then just stop firing. That's not a problem of course.

-Other general comments

The kickback I had with my old Emag is gone, as are the shops.
Incredible improvement of the mags!

Offical LVL10, Reports from the Field Thread

Offical LVL10, Reports from the Field Thread

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