Something New for Tom to think about

[kruger]

Ok, been thinking about it for a while and thought I should get it into the open. If this has been tried or thought of before, then I apologize in advance.

When a paintball is in the barel of a marker, it is at rest. Tremendous forces are applied to the paintball when the compressed air is introduced to fire the paintball from the marker. The paintball has to overcome the energy of the air in the barel and push the air from the marker as the paintball accelerates down the barel. Could you, or would you want to, inject a small burst of high pressure air in front of the ball, just micro-seconds prior to actually firing the ball?
This would do two things for you. First, it would get the air in the barrel moving in the right direction (away from the ball), thus creating less resistance on the ball as it leaves the marker. (lower operating pressure) And second, it would create a vaccuum on the front side of the ball to actually pull the ball forward. Timing would be critical on this one. Thoughts???

[BigEvil]

Even if, hypothetically, this increased range by 200 feet, people would complain that it's not air-efficent.

[kruger]

just an idea that I was toying with. What it would really do is allow you to lower your operating pressure. You dont have to dump a ton of air down the barrel, just enough to start the air moving away from the ball so the ball does not lose energy trying to push the air out. I do realize that we are talking about a small advantage here and there would probably be no great leap in paintball tech gained, but as in Drag racing, it's easy to make the 6 sec range, the hard part is shaving those tenths off of the time. Same principal here.

[UTDragun]

it's not air-efficent.

[CKY_Alliance]

ok im not sure i understand you correctly. what your saying is inject a burst of air in front of the ball going away from the ball kinda like dry firing then shooting the paintball? the burst of air in front of the ball would have no affect on the ball because its in front of it if anything wouldnt suck the ball down the barrrel and casue the bolt to not even hit the ball causing even worse distance? maybe i misunderstood what you are saying.

[kruger]

like I said, timing is everything here. With electro boards, you can fire a sol. at any time you want. We are talking microseconds prior to the release of the air to fire the paintball. You would have to use a specially built barrel for this to work. In front of the ball, have two small air ports in front of where the ball is setting. At a calculated time, "X" microseconds before the ball is fired, you shoot a small burrst of air in front of the ball, down the barrel. This starts the air in the barrel moving down the barrel, or away from the ball if you understand that better. It also creates a small vaccuum on the ball and tugs it into motion down the barrel. Then, the marker releases the main charge of air to send the ball on its way. No ball energy(or very little) is wasted moving the air from the barrel, so you can theoretically use a lower operating pressure to fire the ball. The amount of air that would be needed to shoot in front of the ball would be very small.

[Head knight of Ni]

K.i.s.s.

[kruger]

Oh Knight of NI, I do agree with the KISS principals of life. If all followed those pricipals, then Smart Parts would not be. BUT, others do like to complicate things a bit, and I am just tossing another idea into the stew to see if it falls to the bottom or perks up to the top. The Engineering on this would not be that difficult, and you could retro fit your barrels for this. The timing would be the touchy part, and I think that you would need another solenoid for this to work. Ramping boards and debounce are commonplace nowadays. These are not simple things and people rush out to get them everyday. This would, in my opinion, be something that would improve the efficiency of a marker. This thread was in the Deep Blue section of the forums, but was not deemed worthy of that section. I really wanted Tom to get this idea and see if it had any merit. He has the resources to see if it is viable or just a waste of time, which, obviously I have plenty of right now.......

[hitech]

To what end?

[Kallahan]

It wouldn't add that much range because as soon as the pre-blast exited the barrel it would rapidly dissipate. It would be louder, more air coming out of the barrel. It would also probably weaken the ball considerably by pushing it against the bolt, maybe breaking it (there is no way I can think of to keep this system from effect a ball in the breach) . And as afomentioned wouldn't be air efficent.

Short story, the only way to sell it is to put it on a timmy.

[kruger]

well, the standard answert is this: Better efficiency, lower operating pressure, able to use even the most brittle of paints, less distortion on the paintball therefore more accuracy. Items at rest tend to stay at rest. Items in motion tend to stay in motion. If you move the air for the ball, then the ball does not work as hard to acheive its selected rate of speed. For the ball to move, the air's gotta move out of the way.

I am not looking to get anything off of this idea, if that is what you are referring to Hitech. I just thought that it is an idea that may be of some use to people in the paintball industry. Its actual value may be negligible at low rates of fire, but at higher rates? I dont know fluid dynamics well enough to tell that answer.

[kruger]

As for added range, I never said that it would add range to the ball. That was referred to in another post. But, it could provide better accuracy. Also, if you are familiar with the Venturi effect, then that is the principal that I base this on. If you are not familiar with this, then think of a carburator on a car. Air rushes into an engine and draws fuel in with it. The holes in the barrel would be put in at an angle (not 90deg) to the ball. Pointed away from the ball down the barrel. This would create the Venturi effect in the barrel and move the air out and start the ball down the barrel. Just so all know, the ports would be placed between the exit end of the barrel and some slight distance in front of the ball.

[AGDlover]

i see where your comeing from but if you watch a paintball comeing out of a barrel in slow-mo u can actualy see that a paintball foarms an oval shape because of the speed. thus being said because of the speed it wouldnt help at all

[kruger]

is it because of speed? or air resistance to the ball getting up to speed? In a vaccuum, there would be less deformity to the ball. I do understand that inertia will cause the ball to deform, but not really that much at the speed (300 fps) we are talking about.

[AGDlover]

mostly because of air resistance because of an un arowdynamice object trying to go 200 some odd MPH and you dont see and sphear shaped dragsters do ya? its kinda like a red line effect i guess you could say