So what new has happened in the last two years?

[dahoeb]

Get over the whole AKA deal, Sp had every right to do what they did, they legaly could, and did. The patent was granted, the patent was enforced. I dont see any one complaining about ICD, who was attacked more than once by sp. So get off your high horse. Paintball has reached a technical plateau for the moment, get over it.

wow, just wow....
what are you talking about? half that stuff i already said. and i didn't debate any of it.
so whats there to get over? weird.

moving on. i did forget to mention that icd also was sued by smart parts, but they still produce and design markers.

[JOESPUD27]

For those who aren't having fun in "paintball today" and wish to go back to the "glory days" I would like to suggest Pump/SC play. It is as close as it comes to the "good ole days".

Also, I think people get their shorts in a bunch more over AKA than ICD because people, in general, feel that AKA made better products. So, it was seen as a bigger blow to the paintball world. Just my $.02

Jay

[dahoeb]

yea, the viking and excal were both far superior to anything SP had at the time.

[magman007]

superior in what means? sp had the shocker out then, it was doiminating the scene, and still does dominate, up there with dye, and nps markers.

who all shoots aka markers? jmj factory? i think that it, and what div do they play?

yea. Sorry, cant bash a product that more players choose on a personal baisis. it sells better, and there fore it meets more players specifications than either the viking or excal

[cuttydiamond]

jeesh,
i didn't realize that i'd cause such a ruckus with that one little sentence.

yes, compared to years ago, paintball has got a little more depressing. i'll go ahead and explain why, before you (blazestorm and cuttydiamond) go pulling out your hair over it.

1. nothing new lately. a few years ago, we had things coming out like old school shockers and angels and warpfeeds and nitrogen and electric hoppers and barrel kits. all kinds of new innovations and technologies that were exciting and making me go "wow, this is amazing stuff". lately, its been, "oh look, a new spinoff. oh how about this, another new spinoff." that ties in with my other comment in in my previous post where i said "no really new innovations have been developed except for the qloader (and mqvalve)."

2. i'm not saying i hate this sport, i'm not saying this sport isn't on the right track. if you read and think about it, i'm saying that paintball technology has leveled out and seemed to reach a plateau and hasn't made any big jumps lately. its not anyones fault. so many of the flaws have been corrected, theres not much else to really innovate for! i'm not saying its the companies fault.

and i really don't appreciate somebody that doesn't even know me, telling me to get out of the sport. you need to calm down cuttydiamond/blazestorm, it sounds like your getting all worked up over this.


3. and yes, all the hype does make me sick. it makes me sick to see that bud orr is toting his walmart autocockers as "the most accurate in the world". its not even that big of a deal to me though. cuttydiamond/blazestorm, a few years back most of the hype going around was simply because nobody knew better; there wasn't enough tests or experiments to disprove the manufacturers claims and theories. but multiple tests have been done and most of the theories have been disproved, like closed bolt accuracy and range.

but just cause i'm not a big fan of certain companies marketing tactics, doesn't mean i don't like the sport or enjoy playing it.

and if you think my original post was bias, well good for you. i was trying to be unbias and i think i did a pretty good job. if you wanna go cry about it go somewhere else to someone that cares.

i never said anything about wanting paintball to change blazestorm, so take your little revolution somewhere else.
all i listed were some recent things that have changed in paintball and you just go buck wild with it and declare that i want paintball to change and to go back to the old way. calm down.

blazestorm, how did you not see much truth? i guess ryan greenspan didn't get suspended for cheating....i guess k2 didn't really buy brasseagle and worrgames, i guess smartparts didn't really almost destroy akalmp. yes, blazestorm, those are all bias opinions, haha, whatever man.

yea, i put in my own 2cents, but i never tried to change anyones beliefs and i never said anyone was wrong. it was pretty clear that those were my own personal feelings and did not reflect anybody elses. get some thicker skin blazestorm/cuttydiamond, thats the only advice i can really give you regarding that.

next time i'll be sure to be 100% politically correct so i don't hurt your feelings.

I am glad and do appreciate that some of you took my post for what it was though. I was just trying to help a brotha out.

I would just like to appologise for the tone of my post, i didn't want dahoeb to think i was attacking him personally. I got home last night after a long night of drinking and did a little drunk posting. My bad!

I won't, however, appologise for my opinions. What i was trying to get across is that you should play the game because it is fun. As for it being a sport, game whatever that is up to you. Just like in any other sport, the professionals make up less than 1% of the people who play, and the rest of us do it because we like it.

As for the whole technological innovation thing, I have very deep seeded feelings on this subject. You can not force innovation and ideas are not dictated by a schedule. I work in a creative field (jewelry design boys, if your lady is unhappy, i can help) using 3D computer design programs, and i constantly have to remind the president of the company he pays me to be innovative with my designs, but trying to apply the creative process to a calender is impossible. Ideas will come, but you have to be patient. Ask Rogue how much time he invests into new products before he sees the first dollar of profit.

Anyway, I just wanted to appologise for my attitude, it was inappropriate, but my opinions are just that, and i am intitled to them.

[dahoeb]

I would just like to appologise for the tone of my post, i didn't want dahoeb to think i was attacking him personally. I got home last night after a long night of drinking and did a little drunk posting. My bad!

I won't, however, appologise for my opinions. What i was trying to get across is that you should play the game because it is fun. As for it being a sport, game whatever that is up to you. Just like in any other sport, the professionals make up less than 1% of the people who play, and the rest of us do it because we like it.

As for the whole technological innovation thing, I have very deep seeded feelings on this subject. You can not force innovation and ideas are not dictated by a schedule. I work in a creative field (jewelry design boys, if your lady is unhappy, i can help) using 3D computer design programs, and i constantly have to remind the president of the company he pays me to be innovative with my designs, but trying to apply the creative process to a calender is impossible. Ideas will come, but you have to be patient. Ask Rogue how much time he invests into new products before he sees the first dollar of profit.

Anyway, I just wanted to appologise for my attitude, it was inappropriate, but my opinions are just that, and i am intitled to them.

cuttydiamond,
apology accepted. and i agree with you 100% believe it or not. you do have a good point on the technology/innovation thing. just realize i wasn't trying to knock paintball or paintball companies or anything because of this. i was just sorta making that statement so the thread starter knows that theres not some special new marker out there that shoots 300yards without a bolt or valve and works on a nuclear reactor or something.

[dahoeb]

superior in what means? sp had the shocker out then, it was doiminating the scene, and still does dominate, up there with dye, and nps markers.

who all shoots aka markers? jmj factory? i think that it, and what div do they play?

yea. Sorry, cant bash a product that more players choose on a personal baisis. it sells better, and there fore it meets more players specifications than either the viking or excal

hey smart one, i see you came back for another lashing. hahaha

where to start where to start. well for one, i said "yea, the viking and excal were both far superior to anything SP had at the time.". at that time they had the old school shocker, and the older impulses. i'm not talking about the nerves or the 03 shockers.

anyways, lets start with the old shocker: both the viking and excalibur were as low pressure as the shocker, had a faster firing rate without an 11bps cap like the shocker. they also didn't require a smart parts battery like the shocker. accuracy can't be debated because thats mostly a barrel/paint match. the quality of aka markers is only matched by agd markers, and shockers had a notorious reputation for breaking down and being high maintenance. the shocker was also very inefficient. but according to you the shocker is superior. sure it was.

the impulse: the impulse i owned was tempermental and i've seen many that could be regarded as finicky as the shocker. it required that stupid grease again. it had a maxflow. i have never had a good experience with a maxflow regardless of what others have said, i think the sidewinder is much better, and is much more reliable. the impulse also came with a rather disgusting stock trigger. i don't know about the excal, but the viking came with a "decent" trigger at least, not nasty like an imps. the impulses efficiency isn't that great either, its "ok" at best, even after upgrades. viking and excals, we're talking 1700+ per 68/4500 fill. and thats stock. not many markers match that even today. the ego is all i can think of.

maybe you don't see many teams running around with viking or excals cause THEY'RE NOT MADE ANYMORE! hahaha i mean, i could be wrong, but i think thats a pretty good reason. yea.

"Sorry, cant bash a product that more players choose on a personal baisis. it sells better, and there fore it meets more players specifications than either the viking or excal"

hahaha need i say more? i really hope youre just kidding or something. seriously.


magman007, go get yourself a cookie and watch your cartoons.

[MaChu]

The sport has become full of more pre-maddonas than ever before. It has sold its soul for money. All the great founders have left. Hype and cheating has over come sanity. Yep, thats it in a nutshell. Oh and paint still costs the same.

[Maggot6]

I really have no clue as to how the patenting system works, but I just thought of something. As well, I probably have every one of my facts wrong, so someone correct me.

Smart parts went ahead and decided to patent the electronic trigger. IF a normal civilian decided to patent the trigger before smartparts did, could they have screwed everyone the same way?

[Automaggot68]

hey smart one, i see you came back for another lashing. hahaha

where to start where to start. well for one, i said "yea, the viking and excal were both far superior to anything SP had at the time.". at that time they had the old school shocker, and the older impulses. i'm not talking about the nerves or the 03 shockers.

anyways, lets start with the old shocker: both the viking and excalibur were as low pressure as the shocker, had a faster firing rate without an 11bps cap like the shocker. they also didn't require a smart parts battery like the shocker. accuracy can't be debated because thats mostly a barrel/paint match. the quality of aka markers is only matched by agd markers, and shockers had a notorious reputation for breaking down and being high maintenance. the shocker was also very inefficient. but according to you the shocker is superior. sure it was.

the impulse: the impulse i owned was tempermental and i've seen many that could be regarded as finicky as the shocker. it required that stupid grease again. it had a maxflow. i have never had a good experience with a maxflow regardless of what others have said, i think the sidewinder is much better, and is much more reliable. the impulse also came with a rather disgusting stock trigger. i don't know about the excal, but the viking came with a "decent" trigger at least, not nasty like an imps. the impulses efficiency isn't that great either, its "ok" at best, even after upgrades. viking and excals, we're talking 1700+ per 68/4500 fill. and thats stock. not many markers match that even today. the ego is all i can think of.

maybe you don't see many teams running around with viking or excals cause THEY'RE NOT MADE ANYMORE! hahaha i mean, i could be wrong, but i think thats a pretty good reason. yea.

"Sorry, cant bash a product that more players choose on a personal baisis. it sells better, and there fore it meets more players specifications than either the viking or excal"

hahaha need i say more? i really hope youre just kidding or something. seriously.


magman007, go get yourself a cookie and watch your cartoons.

You're screwing with the wrong person, dood'.

[magman007]

hey smart one, i see you came back for another lashing. hahaha

first off, cut the holier than thou attitude, that crap doesnt fly with me, or on ao.

where to start where to start. well for one, i said "yea, the viking and excal were both far superior to anything SP had at the time.". at that time they had the old school shocker, and the older impulses. i'm not talking about the nerves or the 03 shockers.

well first off, you dont know your time line, the excal was out in 2001, the impulse hadnt been released yet, and you are right, the only markers sp had been using was the Shocker 4x4 and the evo x cocker. Now, at the time you are talking about, When impulses were around, before the shockers and nerves, The impulse still dominated. Strange was winning, freak factory was winning, and these superior markers hadnt even made a dent in the market.


Also, by at the time, i had been assuming you meant when the viking and excal hit their breif moment of popularity, which was short lived, and only due to a law suit. At that time, sp was already dominating with the Shocker, Nps with the timmy, and gen e and part of dye with the origional matrix. notice how the AKA markers dont fit into the equation?

anyways, lets start with the old shocker: both the viking and excalibur were as low pressure as the shocker, had a faster firing rate without an 11bps cap like the shocker. they also didn't require a smart parts battery like the shocker. accuracy can't be debated because thats mostly a barrel/paint match. the quality of aka markers is only matched by agd markers, and shockers had a notorious reputation for breaking down and being high maintenance. the shocker was also very inefficient. but according to you the shocker is superior. sure it was.

The old Shocker was a pos, but in the time frame you are talking about, it was still dominating the scene right allong with WDP. According to the market, it was superior than the excal. Also, paint to barrel match is a crock, apparently you bought into some market hype, consistency is what matters. Faster firing cap? im sorry, but whose markers were relegated to 13bps and needed to be sent in to have the cap raised? i believe that was aka... and i believe that happened way after the impulse had starrted dominating the scene.

the impulse: the impulse i owned was tempermental and i've seen many that could be regarded as finicky as the shocker. it required that stupid grease again. it had a maxflow. i have never had a good experience with a maxflow regardless of what others have said, i think the sidewinder is much better, and is much more reliable. the impulse also came with a rather disgusting stock trigger. i don't know about the excal, but the viking came with a "decent" trigger at least, not nasty like an imps. the impulses efficiency isn't that great either, its "ok" at best, even after upgrades. viking and excals, we're talking 1700+ per 68/4500 fill. and thats stock. not many markers match that even today. the ego is all i can think of.

Apparently you just didnt know how to take care of your marker, the maxflo is still a great reg, personally i like the sidewinder style my self(dye hyper 2 reg, etc). Disgusting stock trigger, apparently you never shot what aka marketed as a trigger, it was a whole hearted POS, and came stock on both excals and vikings. So the imps came with a crap trigger as well, what does that matter? who didnt change their trigger to their liking? the impulse trigger was not hard to tune to some ones likings, or even swap completely. Also, you are comparing 900 dolar markers, to 350 dollar markers, compare the "upped" impulses to the markers, which were in the same price range, and you will see, that they were on par, and still dominating the scene, again Strange and Freak Factory really pushed the markers to the top. And again, no teams using the viking and excal.... Odd. Efficiency, no one seems to care about it all that much, no one fills their tank once and plays all day, all day air is not a hard thing to do, i fill up after every game, no matter what im shooting.

maybe you don't see many teams running around with viking or excals cause THEY'RE NOT MADE ANYMORE! hahaha i mean, i could be wrong, but i think thats a pretty good reason. yea.

Big deal, if they were all they were cracked up to be in the first place, this probabally wouldnt have been an issue. If these markers were gods gift to paintball, then the industry would have recognized this, and capitalized, And the company would not have had to bow out, they could have afforded the licencing fee, and continued to do business.



See, the thing you dont know is, i have owned an 04 featherlight viking, it shot well, but not up to the hype sourrounding it. Now you talk about hype machines, look at aka, and tell me, there is not massloads of hype in their marketing schemes.


The viking and excal werent the end all of performance. The industry saw this, the players saw this, and continued on their quest to find something that suited the masses.


It is obvious that the AKA markers were not FAR superior to what sp had out, at any real time, because they always had something that appealed to the masses, sold more of, and found its way into more happy and sucessful players hands. Where as AKA did not.


im not bashing aka by any means, but honestly, get off your high horse, and dont go tell me to eat cookies like some little immature forum troll.

[Dayspring]

Bill, you're leaving out one important fact...


YOU'RE A GUN WHORE.

Whatever you're shooting now is SUPERIOR to the gun you were just shooting which was SUPERIOR to everything else when you had it.

[rkjunior303]

Bill, you're leaving out one important fact...


YOU'RE A GUN WHORE.

Whatever you're shooting now is SUPERIOR to the gun you were just shooting which was SUPERIOR to everything else when you had it.

QFT

[SCpoloRicker]

Bill, you're leaving out one important fact...


YOU'RE A GUN WHORE.

Whatever you're shooting now is SUPERIOR to the gun you were just shooting which was SUPERIOR to everything else when you had it.

AKA guns are far superior to just about anything out there, though.

/just about

[magman007]

Bill, you're leaving out one important fact...


YOU'RE A GUN WHORE.

Whatever you're shooting now is SUPERIOR to the gun you were just shooting which was SUPERIOR to everything else when you had it.

nick, thanks for trying to invalidate my point, but if you ask any one, i am not shooting a SP marker at the moment, and i never have. im tired of holier than thou jacaksses like dahoeb, so i am taking him down through intellectual discussion.