is ULT slow?? i dont think so :) VID inside !!

[Lohman446]

The thing is, this is about the theory taht ULT hampers the max rate of fire. You stated this disprove that theory. You didn't even approach 70% of top speed. How could that disprove the theory that it slows it down at top speed?

[Maggot6]

Just a curious question here...

Overshimmed ULT = Bounce,
Pressures over 900 ~ psi = Bounce...

Has anyone made a video where they combined the two? I have not seen one yet. Will we still get results like 34.5 bps because of our loaders?

[atm743]

Just a curious question here...

Overshimmed ULT = Bounce,
Pressures over 900 ~ psi = Bounce...

Has anyone made a video where they combined the two? I have not seen one yet. Will we still get results like 34.5 bps because of our loaders?

damn

i should should of taken a video of that before i shipped it out to etjoyride

mabey it will work mabey not

i never did it but i would belive that the ult on off pin would snap being its soo thin

[RRfireblade]

~34 is the max the bolt can bounce back and forth off a spring , it doesn't really matter how you initiate the condition...it ain't goin' any faster than that. :)

[Z-man]

*intercom voice* Pageing Zack Vettor... Pageing Zack Vettor

ITS Z A K YOU VILE CHILDREN!!! THERE IS NO ZACKVETTER.COM @!#$@$#@#$@$#


Here is what I have to say on this subject. All videos listed on my site here

1- The RT valve and all the many variations out there behave almost the same under various pressures and flowrates. AGD states that the valve has been tested up to 26bps with no shoot down. Back in 2004 I started testing the RT valve off scuba tanks and was able to hit 34bps (for clarification that is 34 paintballs fired over the course of 1 second NOT 2 shots that if strung together would add up to 34bps). This curently stands as not only the fastest video recording of an RT valved Automag firing paint but the fastest video of a paintball marker shooting paint.

2- I have done no video testing of any Automag with a ULT on/off assembly and very limited testing of preset tanks and rapid-fire other than the video made for Centerflag testing the 4CE preset reg. Ill go check the speed of that video but it sounds like ~20bps off a preset.

3- IT'S NOT RUNAWAY IT'S RAPID-FIRE. If it was runaway I could not control ity and I CAN so get it straight!

4- What are we getting at? This whole discussion appears to be getting back to my flow chart I made in jest.



On the 1 hand I see that people always want to see "the fastest" this and that. We can get as detailed as we want.

The fastest Spyder
The fastest Tippmann
The fastest Cocker
The fastest Angel
The fastest Cyborg
The fastest Viking
The fastest DM7
The fastest Automag

We can start sub catagories

The fastest E-mag
The fastest X-Mag
The fastest SFL E-Mag
The fastest UTL Mech Mag
The fastest Stock on/off Mech Mag
The fastest AIR valved Mag

Every day a new video of some "WiCkEd FaST GaT" appears and 99% of them are 15-19bps and the remaining 1% are 20-23bps. New gun, new look, new person, same speeds.

At the same time I watch these same people who tout their gun as the fastest or "it's been proven that this can do this...blah blah blah I couldn't produce this proof if my life depended on it but it's true because I know" revert to saying things like:

"Shooting over 20/24/26bps doesn't matter because you cannot shott that fast legally"

"Shooting over 20/24/26bps is pointless becase 15/18/20bps is fast enough"

So which is it? You place a HUGE level of importance on claiming fast you can shoot (or claim your gun could shoot) and yet you "poo poo" anything that blows the crap out of the competiton.

This video shows a Mag doing 19bps. I can find videos of many different makers shooting 19-22bps. This is the first video I have seen of a ULT valved Mag shooting that speed so that is cool. Never the less an almsot identical video was made by myself almost 3 years ago.

Once I get moved up to Grand Junction I am going to make a new SLEW of movies not only making "cleaner" movies of things I have up now but also seeing if I can break 35bps.

If

[atm743]

Once I get moved up to Grand Junction I am going to make a new SLEW of movies not only making "cleaner" movies of things I have up now but also seeing if I can break 35bps.

If

Awsome ill be waiting to see those vids

[Jotsy]

i have a question. with the ULT bouncing like that, is the trigger pull still light?

[atm743]

i have a question. with the ULT bouncing like that, is the trigger pull still light?

yes

im able to walk the trigger like a electro gun

[Lohman446]

3- IT'S NOT RUNAWAY IT'S RAPID-FIRE. If it was runaway I could not control ity and I CAN so get it straight!

Depends on your definition. If your definition gets technical as RRfireblade has said there are not complete mechanical gun functions there - incomplete sear lockup. One could make a pretty good argument that that defines run away. Now I do understand your argument as well, but both have pretty valid points.

[Z-man]

Depends on your definition. If your definition gets technical as RRfireblade has said there are not complete mechanical gun functions there - incomplete sear lockup. One could make a pretty good argument that that defines run away. Now I do understand your argument as well, but both have pretty valid points.

I can't find a compelling reason to call it runaway as it's controlable on every level. Not only will it not start and stop on it own but I can control the speed that I rapid-fire the gun. No not change the speed via input pressure but by trigger pressure. Runaway implies a lack of control but since I can control every aspect of the markers behavior while rapid-firing I don't think it fits.

I'm hijacking this thread... sorry

[RRfireblade]

Bottom line is can you fan a non-reactive trigger to the same speed?

[Automaggot68]

Depends on your definition. If your definition gets technical as RRfireblade has said there are not complete mechanical gun functions there - incomplete sear lockup. One could make a pretty good argument that that defines run away. Now I do understand your argument as well, but both have pretty valid points.

I'm going to have to ask you, and I know you very well-You put up a damn good arguement.
How is incomplete sear lockup runaway if the shooter is able to control the speed (ROF) that he/she's shooting at?

[RRfireblade]

I'm going to have to ask you, and I know you very well-You put up a damn good arguement.
How is incomplete sear lockup runaway if the shooter is able to control the speed (ROF) that he/she's shooting at?

Doesn't matter whether you call it runaway or not , or whether you can control the speed it runs away.

Simply , is it true semi auto fire?

IMO, no.

It's assisted by the reactive nature of the trigger and it's tendency to bounce or 'run off' if pressure is applied in various manners OTHER than a complete pull and release of the trigger.

[Automaggot68]

Doesn't matter whether you call it runaway or not , or whether you can control the speed it runs away.

Simply , is it true semi auto fire?

IMO, no.

It's assisted by the reactive nature of the trigger and it's tendency to bounce or 'run off' if pressure is applied in various manners OTHER than a complete pull and release of the trigger.

Don't get me wrong Jay, I'm not arguing on the point if it's True Semi or not.
I will agree with you on that point, i don't belive it to be TRUE semi, but I do not classify it under 'Runaway'

[RRfireblade]

True, not just full run away as it applies to some other markers.

What your doing in 'rapid fire' is more like limiting the valves tendacy to run away IMO.

Finding the fine line between where it won;t fire and where it wants to take off , depending of course on how on the 'edge' the markers tuned or set up.