All Downhill From Here?

[Lohman446]

Is it downhill? I would not think so, not from here. AGD has reestablished there identity as a niche company. I think you see the bottom of the hill, if we are discussing purely terms of popularity.

[stop whining buy a mag]

I'll have a go at this one too...

I'd have to disagree with you on this one. You're throwing out a lot of if's.

Most of this stuff is being produced at the moment because of low demand. Low demand is caused by a smaller and smaller market.

I'd hate to offend anyone with this metaphor but AGD is like a cancer patient. They're still fighting (and have people helping them) but more than likely they will eventually lose. They can only hold on for so long.

[Tool-of-death]

I'd have to disagree with you on this one. You're throwing out a lot of if's.

Most of this stuff is being produced at the moment because of low demand. Low demand is caused by a smaller and smaller market.

I'd hate to offend anyone with this metaphor but AGD is like a cancer patient. They're still fighting (and have people helping them) but more than likely they will eventually lose. They can only hold on for so long.

Thats a good analogy. and very accurate but don't forget. some cancer pationts survive :)

[stop whining buy a mag]

I'd have to disagree with you on this one. You're throwing out a lot of if's.

I am throwing out ifs?Show me those ifs, please.



Which stuff? Usually stuff that is produced is done so because of high demand, or its not done.

How does that work?[/QUOTE]

Bah, forgot a "not".

When the market gets to a small niche, it's hard to produce some of the mag aftermarket products and sell all of them.

Lots of the aftermarket frames and whatnot only had batches of a 100 or so because that's all of a market there really is for them. For most people creating these, a small batch of 100 with an even smaller profit margin is just not worth it. Especially with the big headaches.

[REDRT]

Thats not true. Palmer Pursuit Shop and CCI have been doing it for years now. Why would it be different for mags?

Ive been doing it for a few years now, its not all that difficult.



Dye made more than 100, Benchmark did too. I know for a fact AGD made more than 100 Intelliframes & Y-Grips. Logic has said he made more than 100 of his vert frames, and I can assure you I made more than 100 of mine.

So, which 100 batch product are you referring to? And what were the margins on that product you are referring to?

Some people take a guess, and others have actual numbers. If you are guessing, Id say your guesses are wrong. If they arent guesses, please provide the actual data, I am very interested to see the numbers that verify your assertions.

Providing actual data to support them numbers goes both ways you know.

[Tool-of-death]

Providing actual data to support them numbers goes both ways you know.

What is your point?

[mobsterboy]

Providing actual data to support them numbers goes both ways you know.

why would rogue go and state numbers that did not need to be known? Why show all your cards before seeing the flop?

[REDRT]

I'm sorry who appointed you all mighty rule maker Rogue? Wouldn't it be better if anyone spouting off numbers as gospel, automaticly back them up so there is some sort validity in the first place?

[SCpoloRicker]

Laughing at you, not with you T-o-D

[Lohman446]

I don't know. Well it may be common its certainly not in the interest of showing the truth.

How much time would TK have saved if rather than demonstrating the lack of paintball spin he had told all the others to prove it. Or the magic box. Or... well you get the point. Sometimes disproving is done as an intellectual exercise and an attempt to educate, rather than just demanding proof to "win" an argument.

[stop whining buy a mag]

Thats not true. Palmer Pursuit Shop and CCI have been doing it for years now. Why would it be different for mags?

Ive been doing it for a few years now, its not all that difficult.



Dye made more than 100, Benchmark did too. I know for a fact AGD made more than 100 Intelliframes & Y-Grips. Logic has said he made more than 100 of his vert frames, and I can assure you I made more than 100 of mine.

So, which 100 batch product are you referring to? And what were the margins on that product you are referring to?

Some people take a guess, and others have actual numbers. If you are guessing, Id say your guesses are wrong. If they arent guesses, please provide the actual data, I am very interested to see the numbers that verify your assertions.

I'm talking about the previous attempts at electronic mag frames like the one Coolhand did. Even look at the Devilmag frames. Yes, the Devilmag was popular but look at how long they are taking. To run a small batch you can't have a warehouse full of people doing them but they take a long time to do one by one.

I love mags and often encourage people to buy one when their Ion keeps failing them. But it would talk a blind man or a liar to go to a field and tell me that he sees mags on the rise.

[don miguel]

FYI airgun.com is selling everything at least 20% more expensive than other websites. EG- actionvillage minimag oring kit 11$ airgun.com 22$, action village xvalve 300$ airgun 350$

[stop whining buy a mag]

FYI airgun.com is selling everything at least 20% more expensive than other websites. EG- actionvillage minimag oring kit 11$ airgun.com 22$, action village xvalve 300$ airgun 350$

How much is Dye selling DM6's for on their site?

[FiXeL]

FYI airgun.com is selling everything at least 20% more expensive than other websites. EG- actionvillage minimag oring kit 11$ airgun.com 22$, action village xvalve 300$ airgun 350$

And your point is? Lots of manufacturers do that so they don't have to bother with selling them in small quantities. Sure, you can get parts cheaper at other stores, but they buy in bulk and get cheaper pricing if they do so. Look it from a sellers perspective: would you rather sell one part with 10% profit, or 20 parts with 5% profit? The effort of shipping and handling would be roughly the same, but you would gain more profit by cutting labour costs at a lower margin when selling in bulk.

Large shops can afford to buy large stocks, and offer them at a lower price..

[Lohman446]

It is in the interest, which is why its been commonly established. Truth starts with fact.

Your statement is ironic though. You say the interest of showing the truth is by way of making unfounded statements which lack the very thing you say you are wanting to show.


Then that intellectual exercise and education should first begin with knowing how to establish an argument.


Nobody is trying to win an argument yet. Just to have one based on facts. You cant "win" an argument if one hasnt been established. To disprove someone, you must disprove some sort of support, not their opinion.

I meant to seperate the two. Sure you can simply seek to disprove someone elses argument. Its an interesting intellectual endeavor.

Its is not mutually exclusive though to showing, with your own evidence, why you are correct. If I say that spiral porting makes the ball spin stabilize itself for added accuracy you can tell me to prove it all you want, ask for my facts and figures all you want. Or you can take a machine that spins the entire marker and ball together up to an insane speed, use a high speed camera, and prove that spinning a paintball does not stabilize it, so it cannot have an impact on accuracy. I know what TK would have done