ATTN...sifu01

[JRSJKD]

Was just reading through some posts and saw your screen name. It caught my attention and then I saw your sig. As you can see from my screen name ...we share similar intrsts Just curios as to where you train/teach and who your an instructor under. I'm in L.A. and train with Guru Dan.

Junior

[Rocp15126]

and train with Guru Dan.

Wow! That's awesome! Talk about learning from the source! I am also into MA. I'm in Pennslyvania and after I start college (yet again!) I plan to find a FMA/JKD instructor in the area.



Rocp15126

[MantisMag]

i know what jkd is what's fma? by the way i study seven star praying mantis kung fu.

[Rocp15126]

FMA = Filipino Martial Arts


I haven't had the pleasure of experiencing seven star praying mantis. The little I know of it is from articles in magazines by Sifu Jon Funk.

[ScoobYSnax]

I was going to join a local Kung Fu Academy (Vermont) that teaches a variation of Praying Mantis. Due to time and money, however, I was unable to do so. In the summer, however, I might pick it up. How do you like it Mantis? How long have u been studying? Thanks...

[MantisMag]

i like it a lot. i've been practicing for a little over three years now. it's a high level style so it incorporates parrys and using your opponent's energy against him as opposed to blocking and straight forward attacks. but it's on the lower end of the high level styles so there are some linear attacks as well as the circular.

the various mantis styles are very different. of course all of them claim to be the original. i think it's likely that 7star was the first though. either that or southern mantis. the story is fairly common that the originator of praying mantis originally studied other styles. 7star incorporates a lot of monkey style footwork. there are hand techniques from several styles. southern mantis seems to be a purist form. looks more like a real praying mantis than any other style. very little footwork. bladed hands. there's also eight flashstep. (i might be wrong on the number eight.) just as the name implies there's a lot of very quick fancy steps in it. there are several others but i don't know what the key characteristics of those are. oh there's a tai chi mantis too. obviously very flowing and soft. oooo. and there's a drunken mantis style. very cool. hehe. there's more that i'll probably remember later but i'm gonna stop there. if you have any other questions or want me to elaborate more on anything i'll be happy to post more. just ask.

[Mango]

Haha yeah MantisMag is insane, he knows his stuff and I would not like to be on the reciving end of his kung fu. When I would just play spar with him I would get punched in the gut about 4 times and get my arms tied in knots! haha. Amazing stuff.

I studied Wing Chun for a while, but forget it all now. hahah.

[MantisMag]

thanks for the vote of confidence john. you should learn something. with your size and strength you could really do some damage. don't know if mantis would be right for you. i don't know if you would be able to pull it off with all those damn muscles in the way. i think muay thai would be good for you. i could definitely see you doing muay thai.

[JRSJKD]

attn sifu01

ROCP
There are some good silat instructors out there in PA. Went to a couple of seminars out there when I was still studying Bukti Negara in MI. Pendekar De Thouars was awesome......really funny too!

Mantis......just curious as to what constitutes a high or low level style? I always wanted to learn some Mantis......if for nothing else that to get some of those energy drills....not sure which particular one they are from or if the enrgy drills are indigenous to all of the mantis forms. Cool stuff either way.

Junior

[MantisMag]

high level styles are those that use your opponent's energy against him. usually this involves grappling but not always. parries are used instead of blocks. (parries redirect a blow instead of attemting to stop it) these styles are almost completely defensive. offensive moves are very basic. once your opponent commits himself however there are many counter attacks and combinations you can use. the main thing about high styles is the efficiency. you don't need to be very strong. not much effort is required to use them. chi cultivation is also very important in most high styles.

a low level style is just the opposite. attack and defense are straightforward and use physical strength to be effective. moves are deliberate and forceful. everything is at right angles.

traditionally people started by learning a low style to learn the basics of punching and kicking. also to build strength and endurance. then a high level style would be learned. true masters always fought using a high style. low styles were only for training.

here are some examples of high and low styles.
low styles: tiger, monkey, hung gar, karate, tae kwon do
high styles: dragon, tai chi, aikido

[JRSJKD]

This is not a flame ....so please take it with a grain of salt......

I think to classify any style or system as a high or low level is a gross mis-characterization. The whole hard vs. soft debate has been around since before you or I were on the planet. I think that if you were to train for three years in a "low level" style you may come away with a different mind set and even may find alot of merit. To start to say that one system is better than another is to start to close your mind to new ways of thinking.

"True masters used high level......." thats way to broad and sweeping a statement.

In my experience, there are GREAT Martial Artist's, not great Martial Art's. You have to find what works for you. What works for me may not be good for you. To that end how can we say that one martial art is better than another.

Anyway....look forward to some good dialog...

Junior

[MantisMag]

ahhhhh but i never said it was actually better. and i said fought not fight. past tense. that is the way it used to be. i was talking about the traditions of shaolin because that is what i know the most about. you see low level styles didn't fit in with a buddhist mentality. buddhists were pacifists so they didn't actually want to fight. they were able to justify low level styles as simply being physical training. high level styles were justified because they are defensive in nature. therefore the true shaolin master wasn't actually fighting. he was simply refusing to accept an antagonist's negative energy and instead turning it back on him. the harder someone attacked a shaolin priest the worse he got hurt. but it wasn't the priest's doing. it was his own negative energy that hurt him.

i would never presume to say my style is better than someone else's. even if i personally thought so i would never say it. that would be disrespectful to those who practice it, work hard at it, and enjoy it. everybody has their own style that is natural to them. i even suggested muay thai to my friend sprayingmango here. that is a low level style. because of his build i think that would be an easier and more natural style for him to learn. everybody is different. and there are so many different martial arts that i think just about anybody can find one to suit them. each has their own strengths and weaknesses. all of us must find our own path. thank you for bringing this up. i probably should have explained all of this in my last post. hope this clarifies a few things.

[MantisMag]

just remembered. i forgot to mention that there are some styles that bridge the gap between high and low. once again i'm going to be talking about shaolin. usually a student of shaolin after practicing some low level styles would have a firm grasp of the basics. before moving on to a high level style they would learn snake style. snake style is considered a low level style because of its strikes. they are vicious jabbing attacks with the fingers to soft areas of the body. there is no using the opponent's energy but there is misdirection and parries. snake is considered a bridge from low to high style but it is more on the low side. mantis was usually the first high style because it has many techniques from low level styles. straight punches and other attacks are common in mantis. however these are only part of the system. there is also grappling and redirection of energy. therefore mantis is considered on the lower end of the high level styles. so high and low levels can contain elements of each high and low. the determining factor is that redirection of energy. no style is completely high or low. every style has its yin and yang. soft and hard. mind and body.

[Rocp15126]

MantisMag

Does your Sifu teach strickly Seven Star or do you learn any other styles/weapons? If I remember correctly from one of my JKD texts, there is energy drill from Mantis Gung fu - the Harmonious Spring Drill. Do you practice Chi Sao and trapping?


JRSJKD

I would gladly train in Silat, unfortunately I cannot locate any schools in the Pittsburgh area! The Dojos and Kwoons here seem to be primarily TKD,Karate and Judo. Which is fine, but I'm looking to experience new ways of training. Lately I've been reading a lot of FMA, JKD, Gung-fu, and Aikido text just to keep thinking and looking at things in other ways. All of this talk is inspiring me even more to start training again! Thanks!

[JRSJKD]

I hate to say it but I haven't been able to train much lately either due to my school schedule