Marijuana Legalization; where do you stand?

[InfinatyBPS]

You just said it yourself, people are already doing it, so keeping it illegal isn't stopping people from doing it as a habbit. And from your logic, looks like cheeseburgers should be illegal too

Originally posted by RT pRo AuToMaG
I'll give you a good reason not to legalize marijuana. It's just something else for people to get a habbit for.,

...

that's all i can think of but i'll add on later.

[WicKeD_WaYz]

I was going to stay out of this thread because I feel so strongly about this and I choose to avoid problems. But I cant even believe all of you people who say "alcohol is worse than pot so why not legalize MJ" That is the worst excuse ever. Alcohol is a different substance and is irrelevant. Im not even going to go in to what I think abour drinking.

I PROMISE that if I took a trip to any of you immature little kids' schools, I could walk around the school and tell you who the stoners are. And you know its true. Take a look at the kids who smoke out all the time, are they going anywhere in life? For the most part NO.(Im sure there is the occasional exception)

Why would you want to legalize something that is harmful to your body? I dont understand why people think its cool to do this stuff and then be hooked on it for the REST OF YOUR LIFE. Guys your killing braincells. They dont grow back. Thats why I paintball. To get away from things like drugs and alcohol.

Anyways...when you say the government spends millions of dollars fighting the drug war... do you really think they are trying to keep people from smuggling weed into our country . Sorry to break it to you stoners, but for the most part your weed isnt grown in Mexico...

We have enough things in this country illegal that cause cancer we dont need another one.

I just dont understand it...WHY WOULD PEOPLE WANT TO LEGALIZE SOMETHING THAT PERMANENTLY AFFECTS YOUR BRAIN. Maybe Im getting off topic...but i would really like to know the reason why you guys smoke? anyone? Ok im sure it feels good. I have never smoked a joint in my life but ok ill give you that...it feels good...

Ill just stop now I could ramble forever

IN CONCLUSION: It feels good to kill braincells.

[oldsoldier]

Well, potheads will support legalizing it, and the rest of us wont. It will never happen, so, deal with it. It is, after all, a government conspiracy to keep it illegal. We all know cops have nothing better to do than throw some teenager in jail for a joint. Please. This is a stupid thread, and needs to be closed. Go vote, if you dont like the laws.

[Restola]

Originally posted by oldsoldier
Well, potheads will support legalizing it, and the rest of us wont.

That may be the most ignorant post on this whole thread.

I truely wish that drug-users were not so vocal about legalization. That way perhaps ONE anti-legalization person would respond to a SINGLE reasonable discussion instead of insanely ignorant posts like oldsoldier's.

[Restola]

Originally posted by WicKeD_WaYz
I just dont understand it...WHY WOULD PEOPLE WANT TO LEGALIZE SOMETHING THAT PERMANENTLY AFFECTS YOUR BRAIN.

Keeping it illegal is doing more harm than legalization would. "Feel good" laws don't help. Driving up the prices of drugs to entice dealers to seek more and younger customers doesn't help.

Since everyone is so insistent on keeping their current opinions, here is a quote from an article I posted a couple posts back.

Here are seven ways to bring peace and security to your neighborhood:

End the war on drugs -- to release from prison the marijuana smokers and other non-violent drug offenders serving 15-year and 50-year sentences. They fill up the prisons -- allowing the murderers, rapists, and other violent criminals to go free on early release or plea-bargains, free to terrorize your neighborhood.

End the war on drugs -- to free up law-enforcement resources to fight violent crime instead of chasing people who may harm themselves but are no threat to us.

End the war on drugs -- to end gang warfare. The drug war has taken the drug business away from pharmaceutical companies and turned it over to gangs operating in a huge black market -- providing untold riches for anyone who will flout the law. This money finances criminal gangs who would be powerless without drug money. Legal drug, tobacco or alcohol companies don't conduct gang warfare and drive-by shootings but criminal gangs will do anything to secure a rich monopoly territory.

End the war on drugs -- to reduce police corruption. With so much black-market money and confiscated drugs floating around, it's too easy for weak policemen to become rich by breaking the law themselves.

End the war on drugs -- to make our schools safer. Brewers and distillers don't recruit children to run drugs or hook other kids on liquor -- nor do they give them guns to take to school. Neither would legal drug companies. Before the war on drugs, the worst schools in Los Angeles were safer than L.A.'s best schools are today.

End the war on drugs -- to end muggings and burglaries by addicts. If Prohibition were ended, illegal drugs selling today for $100 might cost as little as $2, because legal competition -- with no need to circumvent the law -- would drive drug prices down. So addicts would no longer need to steal to support their habits.

End the war on drugs -- to bring back respect for decent behavior. Because nothing can win the Drug War, it is constantly escalated -- destroying more of your liberties with asset forfeiture laws, drug-testing, snooping in your bank account, monitoring your e-mail, racial profiling, and other invasions of the liberty of all Americans. This has caused too many people to disrespect the law itself -- feeling that any kind of law-breaking, victimless or violent, is justified.

-Harry Browne
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/ar...TICLE_ID=13244

Please people. If you are going to post your ideas, use something more than your opinion. READ SOMETHING, ANYTHING, and tell us WHY you believe what you believe. While interesting to some, your simple opinion bares little weight in any actual discussion.

[LittMag]

Originally posted by WicKeD_WaYz
I PROMISE that if I took a trip to any of you immature little kids' schools, I could walk around the school and tell you who the stoners are. And you know its true. Take a look at the kids who smoke out all the time, are they going anywhere in life? For the most part NO.(Im sure there is the occasional exception)

I would beg to differ. I goto an Ivy League school, you would honestly have a VERY hard time trying to point out the people who smoke regularly. You'd be surprised as to how many and WHO actually do.

I just dont understand it...WHY WOULD PEOPLE WANT TO LEGALIZE SOMETHING THAT PERMANENTLY AFFECTS YOUR BRAIN. \

IMHO MJ can be used effectively in a medicinal purpose. I also believe that enforcing MJ laws cause more problems than they prevent and so it should be legalized.

Myself, I've yet to smoke pot, but will try it sometime.

[Restola]

Originally posted by LittMag
I would beg to differ. I goto an Ivy League school, you would honestly have a VERY hard time trying to point out the people who smoke regularly.

LittMag, Wicked is like 14 years old (I'm not making fun of him, just pointing it out). I think he is picturing the couple druggies at his junior high, and thinking that reflects the real world in some way.

I forgot to mention.

oldsoldier, I have never done any drugs, I do vote, and I still support legalization

[InfinatyBPS]

Originally posted by WicKeD_WaYz

Anyways...when you say the government spends millions of dollars fighting the drug war... do you really think they are trying to keep people from smuggling weed into our country . Sorry to break it to you stoners, but for the most part your weed isnt grown in Mexico...

IN CONCLUSION: It feels good to kill braincells.

About the Mexico thing... Wow, your so smart, you just stated what I said but when you said it, it didn't mean anything. And also studies have shown that unlike alcohol, which kills brain cells, THC stimulates brain cells and dosen't destroy them, so there goes your brain damage theory

[Restola]

AHH who cares if it's physicly harmful? People make decisions about their health every day! People decide whether or not to brush their teeth in the morning. Do we need a law for that?

As long as their is full disclosure (People have a right to know WHAT they are taking; another thing that will never EVER happen with drugs being illegal) I do not care in the least what people sell or put into their bodies. Its none of my buisness.

I'll answer the two obvious questions that poses.

Q. What about higher health care cost?
A. I dont support a socialist government health care plan. Insurance companies should be able to charge drug users higher rates, and the government shouldn't financialy support those who destroy their own lives. With the massive amount of saved money, the American public could quite easily decide to financially support charities that offer assistence to those too stupid to make good choices, if they so desired.

Q. What about the children? The innocent victims?
A. Use the billions saved to set up a real child-welfare system. Imagine what $14 billion/year could buy in terms of support, counciling, etc for children of people who would destroy their lives whether some law said it was ok or not (and are currently doing so).

[DaveDog]

There are pluses and minuses to both aspects. Can't say which way I would go. I don't smoke marijuana nor have I ever done smoked it, but some people I know should smoke a lot of it.

[bornl33t]

not every killed with a DWI is drunk. Just what we need, something else for ppl to get killed by, hippies with a car.

[Conine]

Originally posted by SprayingMango
At the Academy, we spent 2 days studying the mountains of research that has been done on the effects of Marijuana on the human body.

They want you to arrest pot smokers. Of course they're going to try and make you feel good about it, otherwise you'd realize how ridiculous it was and start letting them go. It's not like you've gotten your information from several sources and thought it through.

Let me also say that, anyone that needs an outside drug that is solely used as an INTOXICANT to function or to "let loose" or "feel good" IS OF A WEAK MIND AND BODY and needs to get a life.

Right, so I guess that just leaves the people in the world who haven't smoked, had a beer, or a glass of champagne.

Marijuana has been shown, in clinical studies, to contain over 400 chemicals, 60 of which are TOXIC to the body and DIRECTLY relate to Cancer development.

Please point me to a link where a person has gotten cancer from marijuana and not tobacco.

And do not throw the "Alcohol is legal so pot should be too." argument at me.

Why don't you just address it instead of avoiding it?

Alcohol is eliminated from the body in a few hours; THC stays in the body fat for months, even years. A person who smokes two to three joints a week is constantly under the influence of the drug.

I hope they didn't tell you that one at the academy. That's just sad. First off, it isn't THC that stays in the body fat, it's THC METABOLITES. Big difference. Don't mislead people into thinking that you can smoke a few joints a week and that you're staying high the entire time. You're only affected for a few hours. And as far as it staying in your body fat for months or years? It's more like weeks. Beyond that you're talking ridiculously trace amounts that people wouldn't even count on a drug test.

Alcohol, however, can be used in moderation without causing severe damage. Cannabis, which is used exclusively as an intoxicant,

Last I checked, nine states had laws on the books for medicinal marijuana. Can't say I know of too many doctors writing prescriptions for Budweiser.

is far more dangerous even when used in small amounts because its active agent continues to build up in body fat."

1) The active agent doesn't build up, the metabolite does.
2) There's nothing 'dangerous' about THC metabolites sitting in your body fat. And it doesn't just sit there forever, it's constantly being excreted into your urine.

Also, for all you guys out there that smoke up, THC will eventually kill your sex drive by almost stopping the production of Testosterone. And it makes you impotent. Clinically proven.

Where do I start? OK, let's see, THC nearly stops the production of testosterone and makes me impotent. Since this is clinically proven, you won't have any problems producing a link to this evidence, right? Because not even the DEA makes these ridiculous claims.

Kind of funny how during the Super Bowl the ONDCP aired a commercial about a girl who got high with her boyfriend and got pregnant. Apparently it not only makes men lose their sex drive and get impotent, but it magically impregnates women as well.

Well, I personally haven't heard any testimonials from all of these sex deprived impotent pot smokers, but I'll keep my ear to the ground. And I'll be waiting on that clinical evidence. Seriously, I'd recommend you do a little independent research and not just accept all your information from people telling you whatever you need to hear to enforce some poor laws.

[Conine]

Originally posted by Lethargic
A major obstacle to MJ legalization is the presence of these cancer-causing substances in the plant.

Well, the carcinogens are only present during the combustion when it's smoked. You can alleviate the problem by ingesting. But never mind the fact that tobacco is legal, ACTUALLY proven to cause cancer, and a hell of a lot more addictive.

After all, we pay billions to help cigarette smokers who develop cancer, so why should we legalize another provenway to get cancer?

If it's money you're concerned about, the government spends one HELL of a lot more on prohibition than it could ever hope to on medical treatment. For that matter, when it's legalized, it's taxed. That's MORE money to use for any medical issues. As it stands, you're paying for both anyway.

Despite what many pro-MJ websites will tell you, people have developed cancer from MJ. The reason that a lot of cases go unrecorded is that many of these people most likely told their doctors they smoked cigarettes, because MJ is ILLEGAL.

I'd just like you to point me to one documented case. If you can't, you're really just stating your hunches as facts.

Like it or not, THC will remain in the body for the remainder of one's life, stored mainly in the fat cells... The myth is that THC will leave the body after only weeks or a month. This is untrue..... However, THC is fatal in large enough quantities,

First of all, THC doesn't remain in the body. It's gone in a few hours. What remains is the THC metabolite that sits in your fat cells, and excretes itself into the urine as time passes. By the time a month is up, there's so little left that you're considered clean enough to pass a drug test. And it only takes a month if you're REALLY smoking.

Second, no one has ever died from an overdose of marijuana. For you to state that THC is fatal in large enough quantities based on the buildup of metabolites in your fat cells is just absurd. Now I don't know where you claim to have gotten that information from, but I'll be happy to point you to some legitimate information from the New England Journal of Medicine saying "a smoker would theoretically have to consume 20,000 to 40,000 times as much marijuana as is contained in one marijuana cigarette... nearly 1500 pounds of marijuana within about fifteen minutes to induce a lethal response."

Lethal response is based on LD50. It's considered impossible to self-OD on marijuana.

the link

At the same time, his body craves the MJ more and more, until he reaches the same point he would with any other illicit substance.

Quite a story, except I could just plug in 'alcohol' and then it would undoubtedly be true. Except that it would be physically addictive as well, and you CAN od on it. By the way, the same stories were used when people wanted to legalize alcohol.

I feel truly sorry for people who delude themselves that MJ needs to be legalized. They use false facts, skewed data, and sraight out lies to suppor their ideas. Anyone who uses MJ cannot possibly argue for the benefits of the drug, because they themselves are already under its infuence.

Rubber and glue on the facts and data, and for that matter, the lies, several of which I've noticed in your post. The last sentence is utterly ridiculous. If your arguments are so weak that you have to fall back on attacking the character of the person making your counter-argument, what are you really saying? That you're having a difficult time making an argument against someone under the influence?

The man killed while smuggling MJ, the baby killed in a police shootout with a drug dealer, and the family ruined after a child gets high and crashes his car; They are ALL affected by the actions of that one pothead.

Well, actually, they're affected by marijuana prohibition, which is what you're advocating. People who stand for legalization want the killing to STOP. As for the 'child' that's driving while high, I have 2 things to say. 1) No one who advocates legalization advocates DUI. Laws against DUI should be enforced, just as they are with alcohol. 2) The 'child' that you described DRIVES ANYWAY. Prohibition or not, you think that people who would DUI are going to give a crap about following marijuana laws?

The things I have described have all happened, and will happen much more if MJ is every legalized. People like you are the cause of infinite misery in the world, and this will only increase if MJ is legalized in the US.

I've got to know how legalizing will increase police shootouts. As for the cause of infinite misery, look no farther than prohibition. Nothing like giving people criminal records for minding their own business.

Remember, we have freedom of choice here in america, not freedom to ruin the lives of others just so you can have a fun time hanging out with your friends.

Exactly how are the lives of others ruined by hanging out with your friends? And how do you have the freedom of choice when your government will lock you up for plant touching?

I hope I never meet anyone like you in real life InfinatyBPS, because I would bee hard pressed not to beat some sense into his empty skull.

WOW. I don't know what's more impressive, making empty threats over the internet, or showing everyone your true concern for innocent people by beating their skulls in.

[Conine]

Originally posted by Heat
not every killed with a DWI is drunk. Just what we need, something else for ppl to get killed by, hippies with a car.

Does prohibition prevent this? No.

[Conine]

Originally posted by cphilip

I told you not to smoke it. Its a waste of money and it is indeed addictive just like cigarettes are.

Actually, I'm fine with the fact that you think it's a waste of money, clearly that's your opinion, but it's not addictive on the levels that cigarettes are. Cigarettes are physically addictive - your body craves it, while marijuana is AT BEST mentally addictive, I would say less addictive than chocolate or sex in any event, and some people would say it's not addictive at all. Whereas you won't find anyone to tell you cigs aren't addictive.

It robs you of motivation. It cost you money. It may get you hanging with people who will get you in trouble.

Not necessarily. I know the couch-lock you're imagining, but it can motivate you to do things. That's a whole 'nother thread though. Will it cost money? What doesn't? The last line is a direct result of prohibition.

How would anyone know if there was a Cancer related death. No one will tell thier Doctor they smoked pot.

Not really. It's legal medicine in nine states, and you need your doctor to OK it. Also, not everyone is that paranoid about it. There are certain legal rights to privacy you have with your doctors. And just because some people -don't- tell their doctors they smoke doesn't mean the cancer came from the weed. It just means that because it's illegal, no one really knows.

Clearly I agree with you on the part about ruining people's lives legally. That's truly my main motivation. It's senseless to ruin someone's life to protect them from something that was doing a hell of a lot less harm.