Bush Campaign Ad w/ Iraqi Soccer team

[lather]

how many billions have we spent on building up Iraq? Destroying..... righttttt.....

Actually there is 1.4 billion in billing discrepencies in HalliBurton's filings to the US gov't. Interestingly enough, Pres err VP Cheney is still on their payroll.

[e mag]

Boy! I'll tell ya. For Americans, some of you guys have no respect for your own country! Kids are dying right now trying to protect YOU and secure YOUR future! I suppose you guys also support overthrowing the US Government too? Because obviously the Government that we elected is not doing what you want? You really ought to think about the thousands of men that have already died so that we may have and enjoy the freedoms and liberties that are upon us right now. If you can't support the government that we the people have elected than maybe start your own Political party. You might get somewhere...NOT!

Once again, how are the soldiers that die in iraq making us safer? As someone else said, the majority of the US did not elect this government! Furthermore, once a government is elected they can't just do whatever they want; if a government is not doing what you want, you should voice your opinion, in a free country at least. And yes, if you and many others are opposed enough then you should try to overthrow a government. Being for a revolution is not always a bad thing, it is how our country was formed after all. You are very foolish if you unquestionably follow the governments decisions and think that anyone against it has no respect for their country.

[Dirty Dakota]

Fight for the Right

Rights are secured by strength of arms.

The rights that are secured are shared equally. (arab, white, hispanic........)

Their (Ethnic Arabs) right to show their ignorance by celebrating 9/11 or not is just as important as your right to buy or not to buy Smart Parts products.

I don't like that idea that people would celebrate in the death of fellow americans regardless of ethnicity, but....

I am in the Army, I live with this everyday. Hans Kurth a very dear friend of mine was killed in Sumatra on a routine Patrol. We sent him home for a closed casket funeral.

He died for everyones rights, Not your view of them and not mine.

DD

[Dirty Dakota]

But you know what? The Palestinians started it. I have no problem with them being on the bad side of that equation.

What basis in history are you using for who started it....

I do not remeber the exact way is came to be, but wasn't there a Palistine in 1947ish. You know the end of WW2...the British...so on. Or did you go to the Bible where oops there was a Palistine there too.

I thought you said we were all one race?

Don't broker peace and then say "they are all shooting on the other side of the street so it's ok"

DD

[NJPaint]

What basis in history are you using for who started it....

I do not remeber the exact way is came to be, but wasn't there a Palistine in 1947ish. You know the end of WW2...the British...so on. Or did you go to the Bible where oops there was a Palistine there too.

I thought you said we were all one race?

Don't broker peace and then say "they are all shooting on the other side of the street so it's ok"

DD

There was no official "Palestine" it was all British territory. However, there were millions of Jews, Muslims and Christians living there. And relatively peacefully. It wasn't perfect, but it was better than the ethnic cleansing that goes on now.

[taylor492]

Yes, many soldiers have died to ensure my freedom, but not the ones in Iraq, unfortunately.

You are a pompous jerk. I cannot believe you just said that. Ya know you've said alot of stupid things on this forum, but that just crosses the lines. I hope someday, in some Starbucks or something youre having this exact discussion with your anti-establishment, make love not war friends, and a couple veterans of this war hear you spew that line again. I would love to be a fly on the wall for that pummeling. Hell, id love to be in on it!

[NJPaint]

You are a pompous jerk. I cannot believe you just said that. Ya know you've said alot of stupid things on this forum, but that just crosses the lines. I hope someday, in some Starbucks or something youre having this exact discussion with your anti-establishment, make love not war friends, and a couple veterans of this war hear you spew that line again. I would love to be a fly on the wall for that pummeling. Hell, id love to be in on it!

Violent one are we?

[Jeffy-CanCon]

Palestinians started it? Only according to US text books. Zionism? Mass migration of Jews into a land where there are already people? Destroying of homes and forced expulsion of Arabs to make room for the would become Israeli Jews. How the heck do you say the "Palestinians started it?" That all happend well before a single suicide bomber blew himself up.

Jews began immigrating back to Israel/Palestine in the 1890's, led by Zionist doctrine and organization. They BOUGHT land on which to establish farms and communities. The first significant anti-Jewish violence (over 100 dead) began with riots in 1929. And continued through the 1930's, peaking in 1936-38. The Jewish militias defended their communities, but made no counter-attacks until 1938.

The Israeli Jews aren't purely in the right, as they eventually inflicted on their Palestinian Arab neighbours a portion of the same terrible persecution that European Christians had inflicted on them. BUT, the Israelis are less wrong than their neighbours, because they tried peaceful and legal means, first.

The Patriot Act has made you safer.
Homeland security has made you safer.
"Yes, many soldiers have died to ensure my freedom, but not the ones in Iraq, unfortunately". That my friend is an ignorant statement which devalues the lives of the very servicemen fighting for YOU. You ought to rethink that one..
I DO feel for the Iraqi people that think we shouldn't be there, but as soon as they realize that we are trying to HELP them the better off we will all be.

I agree with almost all those points Tunaman. But I can't help thinking of the words of Ben Franklin:

"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."

But Iran hurts people. Sudan hurts people. Turkey hurts people. That isn't a good enough reason.

Iraq was do-able. And eventually, profits from oil and other trade will make up for some of the expense of the war. It's one of the few places where there was a chance of breaking even on the deal. Also, freeing Iraq puts pressure on the Saudis to straighten up, which would not have been achieved by invading the other three places.

Ever heard the proverb: "Pick battles small enough to win, but big enough to matter"?

Actually the Man WE elected is at home in Tenessee. Gore won the popular vote.

...

Why didnt we invade Saudi Arabia? Wasnt most of the Hijackers on 09/11 Saudi? How come we dont invade N. Korea? Its PROVEN they have WMD's and a large portion of their population is starving.

...

The man YOU "elected" is irrelevant. the President of the USA is chosen by the electoral college, not the public. Your country is a "republic", not purely a "democracy".

For invading North Korea, or Saudi Arabia, see reasons above. North Korea is militarily very strong, and may have nukes. Saudi Arabia is weak, but by invading the Holy Land of Islam, you'd have a much bigger terrorist problem than you are experiencing in Iraq.

...
I thought you said we were all one race?

Don't broker peace and then say "they are all shooting on the other side of the street so it's ok"

DD

We are all one race, humans. But we are divided into sub-groups based on religion, language, culture, etc.. And sometimes those sub-groups fight. Usually, one side or another starts it. The side which is attacked is generally permitted something called "self-defence".

If a big man throws a first punch at a smaller man, and ends up getting his butt kicked, is he a victim? Or did he get what was coming to him?

I wish there was peace in the Middle East, and everywhere. But for that to happen, EVERYONE has to stop fighting.

[CaptaiN_JacK]

President Bush is the ONLY person in the US that has the mental capacity to handle terrorism. Absolutely nobody or group would have handled terrorism as efficiently as Bush did. Notice how many times we have been attacked since he got into office? Oh wait, it's gotten worse....

Once more just so you people can get it through your heads.

<font size="20pt">Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11.</font>

[RoadDawg]

Just wanted to add a tiny bit. Why if we went in to remove Saddam for his evilness did we ride the claim of WMD? It wasn't til we found none that we changed the story, although he probably used them all up after the original Gulf War.

Bush has exploited what happened on 9/11 and used it for his benefit. In fact I remember NYFD being upset over one of his politcial re elect me ads that showed ground zero and the fire fighters crying. I think Bush is a puppet. I think someone like Cheney is pulling the strings making him dance and sing. Maybe that's why he's logged more vacation time then any president in history.

Anyways. The soccer player and coach have a right to say they don't want to be apart of Bush's campaign. It's true we have killed innocents there, hell innocents are a part of war sometimes. That's what they call "acceptable losses". We have blown a ton of buildings, roads etc up as well. The only difference between WWII is that we weren't footing the bill alone (pretty much are now). Also I'm sick of people that bash France for not joining the war. Hell I applaud them. They stood up for something they didn't think was right. Sad thing is they were right, til we changed our story/reason.

[-Carnifex-]

Arguing in this place is like arguing on PBnation. No one bothers to use facts to back up their claims, but that doesn't matter because democrats are idiots.

Anyway, good luck everyone. I'm off to offtopic.

[Tunaman]

"I want the violence and the war to go away from the city," says Sadir, 21. "We don't wish for the presence of Americans in our country. We want them to go away."

Well the feeling is quite mutual good fella. I really don't like terrorists in my country either.

[Rooster]

"Nor do I see how creating more terrorists because of our occupation and inadvertant killing of Iraq / Iraqis makes us safer."

We arn't creating terrorists. Islam is. We are a convienent target. American foriegn policy is nor more a reason to target civilians than setting up an abortion clinic is.

But to the crying liberal, the big bad America and its evil is to blame for the world's problems. The liberal scum has gotten so afraid of offending some dirtbag by putting the blame where it belongs, that they find it easier to blame their own government. It doesn't matter what kind of squalor you live in, how baddly someone descriminates against you, how much poison is force-fed into your brain by some nut job cleric, it doesn't justify strapping a bomb to yourself and blowing up a bus load of children. No one is to blame but the people who comit these atrocities, the people who enabled them to do the deed, and the scumbags that try to justify it away.

[lather]

I wonder how the people here surprised about the Iraqi people's attitude towards us after liberating Iraq would feel about France sticking around after helping us secure our freedom against the Brits during the American Revolution..

[Kellen_p8nt]

HOwever to go back on track. Im gunna have to side on Sadir with this. Regardless of how You feel about our actions in Iraq, If Sadir His coach and his teamates do not wish to be used as propoganda they should not be.