Should Marijuana be legalized for medical purposes/recreation?

[bofh]

But instead of bustin their livers their bustin their brains.

And you can get Liver transplants... Just ask Mickey Mantle

[LudavicoSoldier]

"A census taker once tried to test me. I ate his liver with some fava beans and a nice chianti."

[fcpchop]

On the other hand, ive never heard of somebody smokin without the intention of gettin high, but maby im just sheltered.

Doing it after work on your own time doesnt make you a wasteoid, it just makes you that much slower, and that much more helpfull on your kids math homework in ten years.

ok, yes, you are sheltered. Many people smoke without the intention of gettin high, they do it for many reasons. People assume too much, they assume that smoking makes you "slow" or dumb. Thats a load of crap, show me some proof and maybe I will listen to you then. Many of the smartest kids I know smoke, they were smart before they smoked, and smart after. Generalzations and assumptions will get us no where. Sorry but in my opinon this thread has gone done the gutter, both sides have said what they had to and made good arguments. But there isn't much else to say that hasn't been said already. All it is now is bickering back and forth and gettin off topic. I say we leave this thread as it is since we can not contribute anything usefull to it anymore.

[Eric Cartman]

Your average non-smoker doesnt go home and get drunk after work, a few beers for the flavor maby but getting drunk every time they put in extra hours would be a bit extreme wouldnt you say?

On the other hand, ive never heard of somebody smokin without the intention of gettin high, but maby im just sheltered.

Having a "few beers for the flavor" is the same as smoking a bowl.

But when you make it legal you make it habitual, people will use it as you said, to chill after a hard days work so on and so forth.

The legality or lack thereof has nothing to do with people forming habits. Cigarrettes are legal and yet I don't have a smoking habit. Coffeee is legal and yet I don't use caffeine. There are plenty of legal stimulants and downers out there and yet I don't use them either. People with addictive personalities will form habits and addictions to all sorts of substances and behaviours (gambling anyone?) whether they are legal or not. That doesn't mean that the majority of people are unable to use these things in moderation. Legalizing or decriminalizing marijuana wouldn't noticeably change the number of users, it would just mean that they weren't criminals anymore for doing something that is no different from drinking.

[Jakedubbleya]

ok, yes, you are sheltered. Many people smoke without the intention of gettin high, they do it for many reasons. People assume too much, they assume that smoking makes you "slow" or dumb. Thats a load of crap, show me some proof and maybe I will listen to you then. Many of the smartest kids I know smoke, they were smart before they smoked, and smart after. Generalzations and assumptions will get us no where. Sorry but in my opinon this thread has gone done the gutter, both sides have said what they had to and made good arguments. But there isn't much else to say that hasn't been said already. All it is now is bickering back and forth and gettin off topic. I say we leave this thread as it is since we can not contribute anything usefull to it anymore.

My crowd was the drug crowd, i roomed with methheads in college, i work with recovering addicts, ive had friends killed and relationships ruined. sheltered i am not, i would wager i know more about the world and reality of drugs than you do. I DID these drugs, and many of my friends still do, although i have convinced most of them to try and quit.

Ok, so they are still smart. So what? I never said it makes you completely retarded. But i bet they arent AS smart. Its not "a load of cap" its been proven, and ive seen it happen, without exception.

Ive read the thread, i think some things havent been said yet, dont respond if you dont feel a need to.

Having a "few beers for the flavor" is the same as smoking a bowl.

people that smoke a bowl recreationally every once in a while still get high off that bowl. not the same. The only people i know that smoke without getting high are the ones that also smoke 3x a day and will smoke a bowl just to be friendly even though it doesnt effect them, only to later down a half eighth.

The legality or lack thereof has nothing to do with people forming habits. Cigarrettes are legal and yet I don't have a smoking habit. Coffeee is legal and yet I don't use caffeine. There are plenty of legal stimulants and downers out there and yet I don't use them either. People with addictive personalities will form habits and addictions to all sorts of substances and behaviours (gambling anyone?) whether they are legal or not. That doesn't mean that the majority of people are unable to use these things in moderation. Legalizing or decriminalizing marijuana wouldn't noticeably change the number of users, it would just mean that they weren't criminals anymore for doing something that is no different from drinking.

I was referring to the people that would normally get smoked out w/ their friends but never put up the kind of money required to buy their own weed. Not the kind of people that dont drink caffeine because they think its bad for their blood pressure.

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as was stated earlyer, this whole movement is just one big fling for people to get justification for wasting their paycheck on a dumbing anti-social high.

[Eric Cartman]

My crowd was the drug crowd, i roomed with methheads in college, i work with recovering addicts.

If this is true, then you know that recreational marijuana users and "methheads" are worlds apart. If you're working with recovering addicts, then you're seeing the worst case scenario all the time and it's giving you a rather closeminded view. Just as someone who worked with recovering alcoholics would probably take a pretty dim view of relaxing with a couple of cold ones and watching the game.

Ok, so they are still smart. So what? I never said it makes you completely retarded. But i bet they arent AS smart. Its not "a load of cap" its been proven, and ive seen it happen, without exception.

Marijuana kills brain cells. So does alcohol. The amount killed depends on the amount used. Moderate use of alcohol will result in about the same amount of brain damage as moderate marijuana use.

people that smoke a bowl recreationally every once in a while still get high off that bowl. not the same.

It is the same. Someone who drinks three beers in an hour is impaired. Someone who smokes a bowl in an hour is impaired. The level of impairment is almost identical although this can obviously be affected by the size of the bowl, the quality of the marijuana and the tolerance of the user just as the body weight and tolerance of the drinker will affect the level of impairment. All things being equal, the effects are the same.

I was referring to the people that would normally get smoked out w/ their friends but never put up the kind of money required to buy their own weed. Not the kind of people that dont drink caffeine because they think its bad for their blood pressure.

I don't understand this. Are you saying that people who won't pay for marijuana now would start to pay for it if it was legal? Odds are very good that if it was legalized, it'd be more expensive than it is now. Never underestimate the greed of the tax man.

as was stated earlyer, this whole movement is just one big fling for people to get justification for wasting their paycheck on a dumbing anti-social high.

Of course. That's what it's all about. It has nothing to do with the basic hypocrisy of legal alcohol and illegal marijuana. It has nothing to do with making a very helpful substance available as medicine to people who are suffering from a variety of problems. It's all about people wanting to be broke and brain dead because there is no possible way that people can be reponsible or choose to excercise moderation. After all, you've see it all "without exception"

[Jakedubbleya]

If this is true, then you know that recreational marijuana users and "methheads" are worlds apart. If you're working with recovering addicts, then you're seeing the worst case scenario all the time and it's giving you a rather closeminded view. Just as someone who worked with recovering alcoholics would probably take a pretty dim view of relaxing with a couple of cold ones and watching the game.

Context. I was disputing his comment about my "being sheltered". Nothing else. And by work with i meant they are my fellow employees and good friends.

Marijuana kills brain cells. So does alcohol. The amount killed depends on the amount used. Moderate use of alcohol will result in about the same amount of brain damage as moderate marijuana use.

About the same amount? Use of merijuana has been shown to cause significantly more memory loss and well "motivation" loss than alchohol. In fact in adults, it takes frequent abuses of alchohol to cause ANY real brain damage.

Exception: developing brains take about the same amount of damage from either one. Although with alchohol, the damage is less permanent as the brain will continue to develop normally if one ceases to get drunk often.

It is the same. Someone who drinks three beers in an hour is impaired. Someone who smokes a bowl in an hour is impaired. The level of impairment is almost identical although this can obviously be affected by the size of the bowl, the quality of the marijuana and the tolerance of the user just as the body weight and tolerance of the drinker will affect the level of impairment. All things being equal, the effects are the same.

Id have to disagree with you on that one. Done them both. Its pretty obvious.

I don't understand this. Are you saying that people who won't pay for marijuana now would start to pay for it if it was legal? Odds are very good that if it was legalized, it'd be more expensive than it is now. Never underestimate the greed of the tax man.

As a former member of the world of weed, yes. And I dont see how weed could possibly become more expensive than it currently is by making it legal... ooooh conspiracy theory! lol!

Of course. That's what it's all about. It has nothing to do with the basic hypocrisy of legal alcohol and illegal marijuana. It has nothing to do with making a very helpful substance available as medicine to people who are suffering from a variety of problems. It's all about people wanting to be broke and brain dead because there is no possible way that people can be reponsible or choose to excercise moderation. After all, you've see it all "without exception.

Oh no! Hypocracy!

My lord are you sloppy. I never once mentioned that it shouldnt be used for medicinal purposes. Lol im not an idiot, doctors prescribe drugs that do a lot more damage than weed ever could.

Context. Without exception: Every pot head (somebody that used to or does smoke 2+ times a day) i know is significantly slower than he used to be in my "biased sheltered" opinion. Most of them will actually admit it because it has become so obvious. I have also noticed lesser amounts of memory loss in those that smoke a few times a week. Im not doing official surveys here, its just what i have noticed.

I have noticied similar side effects in my own brain, as i used to smoke daily for about three months. These side effects were made real in a recent psycological evaluation comparing my current brain function to its function two years ago. My former 112 overall memory has dropped to a 103. Although note that every other function has increased in comparison to those my age, which is not uncommon seeing as my brain is still developing, showing that the damage was not universal, or at least not overwhelmingly significant on other functions.

[Chris42050]

Marijuana should be illegal because people are stupid. Alcohol is legal, and it is abused. If weed were illegal, it would be abused just as alcohol is. Does being legal make alcohol abuse right? No, of course not. If marijuana was legal, it would not magically take away it's abuse away. It would only make it easier to abuse.

Have you ever heard of prohibition? If you havent read up and you'll find out just how wrong you are about this.

Edit: Why is it everyones (government whatever) job to decide whats good and bad for people. We should be free to do what we want with our lives. Just because some of you dont beleive weed is good for you... you want to ban everyone else from using it. Make up your own mind and i'll make up mine. Let's stop making stupid laws to force our beleifs on others.

[Eric Of Extreme Measures]

Hey being in the health field, i never wanted to get in on this issue, but a point to make is this.

Ever see that commercial, Brain and then Brain on drugs...

here is a scan of a healthy brain with no Drug use and some Alcohol use.

[Eric Of Extreme Measures]

Now with 12 years of reg. POT use, no other drug use noted., Defined study, Yale, Post Test, 2004

Still Living and Brillant im sure.
The Future of America!

[Eric Of Extreme Measures]

Yeah no harm there, Keep smoking Guys, it is your choice,
Oh NOT!
It is against the LAW, wonder why?

IM OUT of HERE!

Eric

Just wanted to give my two cents, just my two cents..

[Eric Of Extreme Measures]

Ask the doctors, see the materials, read the reports, see the tests, see the scans, see the autopsy findings, go to a recovery meeting and see what the people have to say. talk to them and find out how there lives have been with the monkey on their backs. wait for the nudge from the judge. try and hide from the MAN. sell him the storys about how it should be legal while he is cuffing you. just wait and you will see.....

[Eric Of Extreme Measures]

Ok, im really out now...

[Jakedubbleya]

I love this guy lol

[spantol]

Got any more information on that study? Authors, publication name, date, that sort of thing? I'd like to read that one. Barring that, can you describe what exactly is going on in that second picture? Clearly, one is good, the other not so good, but what are we actually seeing there?

The only study I could find through Google (keywords: yale marijuana) was one that found the temporary physical affects of pot use on the brain resembled those of schizophrenia. I'd imagine that would include some dramatic before and after pictures, but the timelines involved don't match up.

Now with 12 years of reg. POT use, no other drug use noted., Defined study, Yale, Post Test, 2004