Gas Price$ - have they changed your lifestyle yet?

[Lohman446]

Umm, I doubt YOU "remember" the dust bowl, unless it's your great grand kids that play paintball

But that being said, yes, I have read about it and if you remember correctly it wasn't from over planting, it was from years of drought and the fact that nothing grew. This is not the reason farmers are paid not to grow crops, it is because they already have too much corn. The government needs to regulate the amount of corn grown/harvested each year so that the price of corn doesn't go to fractions of a penny per load. As it is, hundreds of thousands of pounds of corn gets to sit in silos and rot each year. If we produced a lot more corn and designate so much of it to fuel, I think we would;

A. be helping our farming community
B. helping the environment
C. helping my wallet

We could also look at corn as a form of fuel for heating homes. Sounds odd, but it works.

Some people around here already use corn as a source of fuel for heating homes. And I agree that the idea seems simple - lets use our intellectual energy to make an abundant, renewable resource that we lead the way in production of into the worlds fuel source.

I don't understand this draw to hydrogen, if we used corn we would solidify our place in the world, strengthen our economy (and Russia I beleive), and the people who hate us most (the middle east) would be left without leverage.

[WenULiVeUdiE]

As far as crude oil goes, WTH are we going to do if they keep raising the prices?? ITs not like we can go get it somewhere else.

That is where they get you. The price of oil for the large companies like BP are not buying oil for the current OPEC price. They have contracts to continuously buy a set number of barrels of oil for a set period of time. But they're smart for raising the price of gas when they're costs dont increase.

At least that is what I have been told from what I read and know.

[Muzikman]

I think it's a great idea and the cars we drive right now can handle Gasohol (85% Ethanol / 15% Gasoline).

If you are running a deisel then you can run a Bio-Deisel mixture which can be made out of the same corn (convert it to oil instead of ethanol).

I think corn is the fuel source of the future and I really hope that future is soon (5 years?).

What I am not sure about is how much corn it takes to make one gallon of Ethanol. It might be a lot more than I think.

[Lohman446]

They SAY that gasoline production that is down and demand is way up.... but who knows. As far as crude oil goes, WTH are we going to do if they keep raising the prices?? ITs not like we can go get it somewhere else.

This is true to a point. Eventually though one has to quit raping the worlds superpowers on oil prices. Both China and the US have a pretty good history of using military power to protect economic interests.

[WenULiVeUdiE]

I think corn is the fuel source of the future and I really hope that future is soon (5 years?).

What I am not sure about is how much corn it takes to make one gallon of Ethanol. It might be a lot more than I think.

Ford has made a prototype SUV with the entire body made out of corn. Apparently it took a whole field of corn to make just the one body with side panels and all.

[slade]

Umm, I doubt YOU "remember" the dust bowl, unless it's your great grand kids that play paintball

But that being said, yes, I have read about it and if you remember correctly it wasn't from over planting, it was from years of drought and the fact that nothing grew. This is not the reason farmers are paid not to grow crops, it is because they already have too much corn. The government needs to regulate the amount of corn grown/harvested each year so that the price of corn doesn't go to fractions of a penny per load. As it is, hundreds of thousands of pounds of corn gets to sit in silos and rot each year. If we produced a lot more corn and designate so much of it to fuel, I think we would;

A. be helping our farming community
B. helping the environment
C. helping my wallet

We could also look at corn as a form of fuel for heating homes. Sounds odd, but it works.

remember the dust bowl? (well probably not, i dont, but remember hearing about it?)

i said i didnt remember it... i didnt mean "remember" as in having been there, i meant as in remember hearing about it...

anyway, from what i heard from history classes, it was from overproduction which drained the soil, and then combined with the drought it created the dust bowl. in which case subsidies do make sense, since they are preventing a disaster like that... even if it is paying people to not work.

however, if what you say is true, then farming subsidies is complete absurdity. paying someone to not grow a product that could replace a fuel that is hard to obtain? it seems like itd be common sense to instead use the corn for ethanol. but of course, no average person is going to do it because of the complexity of it. what would need to happen is a large gas chain get the incentive to start making gasohol and selling it along with regular gas, then get the government to cancel subsidies and use the corn they produce to make ethanol.

of course, even past the production phase there are complexities like how clean does it burn, what effect could it have on the engine, etc.

[Muzikman]

Hmm, not so sure I want a starch bodied car, but kinda a cool idea. I am thinking fuel, not building materials.

[Muzikman]

i said i didnt remember it... i didnt mean "remember" as in having been there, i meant as in remember hearing about it...

anyway, from what i heard from history classes, it was from overproduction which drained the soil, and then combined with the drought it created the dust bowl. in which case subsidies do make sense, since they are preventing a disaster like that... even if it is paying people to not work.

however, if what you say is true, then farming subsidies is complete absurdity. paying someone to not grow a product that could replace a fuel that is hard to obtain? it seems like itd be common sense to instead use the corn for ethanol. but of course, no average person is going to do it because of the complexity of it. what would need to happen is a large gas chain get the incentive to start making gasohol and selling it along with regular gas, then get the government to cancel subsidies and use the corn they produce to make ethanol.

of course, even past the production phase there are complexities like how clean does it burn, what effect could it have on the engine, etc.

The problem with the dust bowl was not the over farming, but the fact that they kept trying to plant crops even when conditions were so dry that the crops would not grow. They took a very dry ground, plowed it up which created loose dirt and then nothing grew which means they now have dry loose dirt that the wind could pick up.

With modern day technology (you have to remember, this happened 70 years ago) I am sure they would not have this problem. (though technology could not prevent droughts, atleast at this time)


Oh, and sorry about the whole" remembering" thing, I read that wrong.

[bofh]

Hmm, not so sure I want a starch bodied car, but kinda a cool idea. I am thinking fuel, not building materials.

It may not be starch based, as they may use the oil's to make a bio-plastic. I dunno.

As for Corn as an energy source.... It sounds good on paper, but it didn't pan out last time, in the late 70's.

[Muzikman]

The starch based car was a bit of a joke, but if it took an entire field (depends on what size field) of corn to make one body, not sure it would be a viable way to produce plastics, or what ever.

Why is it not viable? The only thing I can think of is that it takes way too much corn to make a gallon of Ethanol. The process can't possibly be more complicated as refining oil into gas and it can't cost as much I am sure. The only other thing I could think of is that the oil companies stomped out anyone who tried to produce it in any usable quantity. They like to do those types of things.

[bofh]

Why is it not viable? The only thing I can think of is that it takes way too much corn to make a gallon of Ethanol. The process can't possibly be more complicated as refining oil into gas and it can't cost as much I am sure. The only other thing I could think of is that the oil companies stomped out anyone who tried to produce it in any usable quantity. They like to do those types of things.

From what I remember, the energy needed, and the amount of corn it took where fairly high. You just don't squeeze corn to get ethonol, you have to extract the sugars our of it, and then ferment it, and then distill it. It takes a good chunk of heat.

[AcemanPB]

I think it's a great idea and the cars we drive right now can handle Gasohol (85% Ethanol / 15% Gasoline).

If you are running a deisel then you can run a Bio-Deisel mixture which can be made out of the same corn (convert it to oil instead of ethanol).

I think corn is the fuel source of the future and I really hope that future is soon (5 years?).

What I am not sure about is how much corn it takes to make one gallon of Ethanol. It might be a lot more than I think.

It also takes a lot of energy, which right come from fossil fuels. The same goes for hydrogen fuel cells too. I think we really need find alternative power sources such as solar power and nuclear power, not so much for cars just for energy to make these alternative fuel sources. If we still burn a lot of fossil fuels to make a hyrdogen fuel cell we just spent a lot of time in money to get to the same end. Hopefully a solution is on the horizon.

And as far as it changing my lifestyle - yes it certainly has. I think twice before driving long distances somewhere, I bum rides more often, and because I'm spending more on gas I have less to spend on other things - I play paintball less. But right now I'm a freshman at Ga. Tech and I don't have a car (parking cost 500 dollars a semester!)

[Kai]

I deliver pizzas to pay for college, which means I do a lot of driving.

I can tell you that I am taking a huge hit right now. Especially considering that people are tipping less and less as the gas prices rise higher and higher.

[Jaan]

Well, I started working in Boston in 2000 (actually the last week of 1999 lol) and *back then* gas cost me $100 a week to drive in and out every day, not to mention having to pay for a parking space in the center of Cambridge and the 2 - 3 hour drive every day. Well, eventually I got a place up there besides a house where I am now (need to store all my crap) so I stay in the city when I work and I keep a bike up there to ride, and take the commuter rail in now. So I went from what would be $200 a week now, to maybe $12 in train / subway tickets.

[BlackVCG]

Senior year of high school I remember paying .99 cents a gallon. Amazingly enough, that was only 5 years ago. I want to say around that time it got up to around 1.60 and then things went down to the point of .99 cents/gal. The gas stations all had signs saying "Gas Wars" and everyone was trying to lowball each other.

Gas will go down, we just won't ever see probably any less than 1.80 or so.

There's a lot going on right now. It's summer time, refineries are down for maintenance (funny how they always seem to do that during the summer), the American consumer still thinks they need a Suburban to carry two kids and groceries, and there's a war in progress.

I'd highly recommend anyone that drives a diesel vehicle to find a local station that pumps biodiesel. You don't need to buy the 100% biodiesel, but even if you buy the B20 every bit of biodiesel you use will bolster that market and bring prices down. Biodiesel is currently the most feasable solution as an alternative fuel source for the ICE. Problem is less than 5% of the U.S. auto market is diesel...