Why are mag parts so expensive?

[Aslan]

Whoa!

First the post morphs into an Ion vs. the World...

...now an "AGD is dead" post!?

This post is covering all the bases.

Next up..."stupid things newbs say" followed by "which kind of marker should I get?" (which will morph back into Ion vs. the World).

I have actually seen a resurgence of Mags. The Woodsball people are buying them used as alternatives to Model98Cs and high priced A-5s. The Tac One is also doing very well with the woodsball/scenario crowd. Remember, we (woodsball folk) make up about 75% of the market and climbing.

The main outcry seems to be from speedballers that want a new, flashy, 30+bps marker every year and rely on the Pro Teams to dictate which marker is the best. If a Pro Team used X-Mags:
A) They would be back to being Agg/superfly cool.
B) Smart Parts would sue because they are the mafia of the paintball industry that wants a piece of every other comapnies take. Smart Parts remind me of that Fannuci character from Godfather II that is shaking down everyone in the neighborhood.

Is it possible that I have planted the "Woodsball vs. Speedball " seed!? Ion vs World, AGD is dead, Speedball vs woodsball...watch out folks...this one is getting crazy!

[tyrion2323]

The main outcry seems to be from speedballers that want a new, flashy, 30+bps marker every year and rely on the Pro Teams to dictate which marker is the best. If a Pro Team used X-Mags:
A) They would be back to being Agg/superfly cool.
B) Smart Parts would sue because they are the mafia of the paintball industry that wants a piece of every other comapnies take. Smart Parts remind me of that Fannuci character from Godfather II that is shaking down everyone in the neighborhood.

Yeah, we speedballers are basically just pawns of the industry. It's like...it's like we don't have brains of our own!



Seriously. Do you truly misunderstand this stuff, or do you intentionally try to start fights with dumb statements like that?

And I'm still waiting on verifiable statistics about the percentages of speedballers versus woodsballers. Show me some numbers. And I don't mean from 2001. I mean from 2005 or 2006.

I would try to argue this, but it's pointless. Since when did AO start seeming dumber than PBN?

[RogueFactor]

And I'm still waiting on verifiable statistics about the percentages of speedballers versus woodsballers. Show me some numbers. And I don't mean from 2001. I mean from 2005 or 2006.

Be the bigger man, and rather than argue, disprove him with some verifiable numbers of your own.

Lack of info doesnt make him incorrect. He can be right without the numbers.

I would think its fairly common sense that any financially viable "paintball" field you go to, the mech/rec/scenario/woodsballer players outnumber the speedball/electro players in any day by about 10 to 1(yes, thats from my own observation).

I could pay the money for the SGMA report to prove you wrong, but I just dont care to prove you wrong.

There is a reason why manufacturers are going after the Tippmann market, both the mechanical and scenario segments.

Chew on that, and let me know what you come up with

[peewee]

I know in my area the woodsballers numbers are much larger than the speedballers. I would also agree with a 10 to 1 ratio if not larger.

[Lohman446]

Be the bigger man, and rather than argue, disprove him with some verifiable numbers of your own.

Lack of info doesnt make him incorrect. He can be right without the numbers.

I would think its fairly common sense that any financially viable "paintball" field you go to, the mech/rec/scenario/woodsballer players outnumber the speedball/electro players in any day by about 10 to 1(yes, thats from my own observation).

I could pay the money for the SGMA report to prove you wrong, but I just dont care to prove you wrong.

There is a reason why manufacturers are going after the Tippmann market, both the mechanical and scenario segments.

Chew on that, and let me know what you come up with

I would argue that its not woodsball vs speedball but rec vs tournament level. I would say at the fields I generally attend if its not in favor of speedball players it is very close. That of course does not consider off field play.

[Beemer]

I would argue that its not woodsball vs speedball but rec vs tournament level.

Agreed

I would say at the fields I generally attend if its not in favor of speedball players it is very close. That of course does not consider off field play.

How many fields do you attend? Out of no less then five fields I attend only one of those would go in favor of the tourny scene. The others Rec owns.

Peace Out

[Corbet]

Regarding woods/speedball, we went to the local PEVs and it seemed everyone played a combo of both speedball/woods, mainly woods. The only people who didn't play woods was a group of 8-12 20 somethings all with Dyes/Angels guns who were supossed pros. We played with them once, I was on their team and they were all like "Is there even anyone good on their team or are they all noobs?" Talk about arogance.

[Lohman446]

Regarding woods/speedball, we went to the local PEVs and it seemed everyone played a combo of both speedball/woods, mainly woods. The only people who didn't play woods was a group of 8-12 20 somethings all with Dyes/Angels guns who were supossed pros. We played with them once, I was on their team and they were all like "Is there even anyone good on their team or are they all noobs?" Talk about arogance.

Thats not always arrogance. Often enough players will pull up and not play hard against newer players - I have often enough asked if the people I was playing with were "bunkerable" and that was normally taken to mean a reasonable level of experience and of age. Not a young / new player.

[teufelhunden]

Like in many/most/all[?] other industries, size is determined by money. I.e., while there may be more of Widget X sold, if more profits are derived from Widget Y, Widget Y is a larger industry.

If one was to look at woods/scenario vs. speedball in that manner, I dare say that if speedball isn't bigger, it's damned close.

[tyrion2323]

Be the bigger man, and rather than argue, disprove him with some verifiable numbers of your own.

I'm not the one making statements. If you want people to believe your statements, you have to substantiate them.

Lack of info doesnt make him incorrect. He can be right without the numbers.

I'm not sure which logic or statistics classes you took, but a lack of info does discredit his argument. Whether he is correct almost is moot here. Again, if you make a statement, back it up. I don't really care which one is bigger, it really doesn't matter to me.

I would think its fairly common sense that any financially viable "paintball" field you go to, the mech/rec/scenario/woodsballer players outnumber the speedball/electro players in any day by about 10 to 1(yes, thats from my own observation).

Again, I'm easy. Gimme some numbers. Anything. Sales records. Advertisement dollars spent. I am not arguing either side. I just want to see some proof. Hey, when I go to my fields, I see only tournament players and speedball players. That doesn't mean I generalize it to the entire body of paintballers.

I could pay the money for the SGMA report to prove you wrong, but I just dont care to prove you wrong.

That's fine, but until someone does, don't expect me to fall for this "we outnumber you" schtick.

There is a reason why manufacturers are going after the Tippmann market, both the mechanical and scenario segments.

That doesn't really mean anything, since tippmanns and mechanicals are used as rentals at nearly all paintball places, woods or speedball.

Chew on that, and let me know what you come up with

Again, not much to chew on. But your snide arrogance does convince me not to buy any Rogue products.

....that's about all I came up with.

[Aslan]

dumb statements and such

Yeah, we speedballers are basically just pawns of the industry. It's like...it's like we don't have brains of our own!

You said it, not me.

Seriously. Do you truly misunderstand this stuff, or do you intentionally try to start fights with dumb statements like that?

Like what? Which statement? All of them? It's fairly easy to see that when people sell their DM5s to get DM6s...after selling their DM4s to get the DM5 a year before...that there is some type of motivation for buying products besides their increase in performance. And I think the marker manufacturers would agree with me...why else would they sponsor pro teams if not to try and convince new players to purchase their products.

And I'm still waiting on verifiable statistics about the percentages of speedballers versus woodsballers. Show me some numbers. And I don't mean from 2001. I mean from 2005 or 2006.

Are you serious? Didn't you ask me for statistics on some other thread? I seem to remember a similar request from you. That's pretty lame. I mean, if you disagree...throw out a number...but don't start demanding credentials. And for the record, there was an article written in one of the paintball magazines recently that talked about the growth of the woodsball game and there was some statistic about woodsballers being something like 75% of the players.

The only reason I remember is because I thought it was kinda high...but then I figured woodsballers represent sppl, scenario, outlaw, and rec players. It represents alot of newer players and the vast majority of older players. As I thought more about it, I guess I could see the stat as being somewhat correct. I didn't call the magazine to ask for verification...it was actually someone else that was quoting it in another forum...I've actualy never bought a paintball magazine excpet maybe once.

I would try to argue this, but it's pointless. Since when did AO start seeming dumber than PBN?

1) Since you made that post just above this one.
2) Seriously...lets hope AO never becomes pbnation...

I don't have statistics...but the vast majority of fields around me are woodsball. There are a couple indoor fields...and I've been seeing alot of the former woodsball only fields putting up airball fields as well as woodsball. But, of the ones that have closed down in the past couple years...all of them have been speedball/indoor fields. I don't know what that means...I have my own theories...or as you would call them, "dumb statements"...but I'll save them for another thread.

[hulk]

[mostpeople]

Because you pay for quality..

and just think, the x-valve is probably the single most advanced piece of paintball technology ever created.

1. Fastest cycling valve w/out shootdown.
2. All in one functionality, it really is the heart of the mag
3. The X-valve while expensive (more expensive than an ion in fact). Will outperform most markers, and will at least keep up with all markers in fully mechanical mode.
4. Robust as hell, drop it in water no problem. Mud, no problem.. (although I wouldnt do it!)


And when your ion breaks because its plastic, I'll make sure to laugh as I shoot you!!

[mag_lover05]

omg noooo let it die.

[Russ]

Look kiddie's, there's a dead horse, let's get our sticks and beat it some more