what would you spend 369 million on?

[bornl33t]

Let me help.

Click on the edit button. And let the page load.
Next check the box that is labed "click here to delete thread"
Finally click the button that says "submit"

It may be rough instructions but it should accomplish what we both want.

There are two sides to every story, the TV will give you one, the other side well... isn't so obvious

[michbich]

So you are defining that your sexuality is not a choice?

If so that is a HUGE statement.

So your saying that you choose to be hetero? So tomorrow can you decide to change your mind?

[MANN]

So your saying that you choose to be hetero? So tomorrow can you decide to change your mind?

I believe so. If I decided to.

Are you stating that people are not in control of their sexual preference?

[wetwrks]

tattoo= choice gay=sexuality

it would be a choice if they went around flaunting it like a gay pride parade 24/7, but the soldier's comrades in the interview had NO idea, neither did his captain, or anyone else in his unit.

thanks wetwrks for providing an argument instead of just stating liberal and moving on. I was hoping we would actually be able to discuss a topic instead of flaming over it.

I would say he technically did go around flaunting it.

Turns out this one guy is registered to a gay/lesbian forum

And someone had to aware of it otherwise he would still be in the military.

I also don't buy the "no choice" thing. Even if it is genetic, that doesn't make it acceptable. They (science) have found a genetic link for alcoholism. Must we accept that as an acceptable lifestyle (including driving drunk and all)? Same with a propensity towards spousal abuse and rape. What happens when (not if) they find a genetic propensity for pedafilia? Do we now have to accept that as a valid lifestyle?

Sorry but I cannot agree with that line of logic.

[Hilltop Customs]

So you are defining that your sexuality is not a choice?

If so that is a HUGE statement.

IDK, ive honestly never had any homosexual feeling towards my friends......so I dont see my sexuality as a choice....its just the way I am.

is it a choice that I like spaghetti pizza? No, it just tastes so yummy(to me). And I'm sure there are people out there in the world who hate spaghetti pizza, is it their choice that they dont like it? I dont have any qualms with people who dont like spaghetti pizza, because I know there is more for me if they dont want any.

[wetwrks]

So your saying that you choose to be hetero? So tomorrow can you decide to change your mind?

Actually there are a great many gays who chose to leave that lifestyle and get married to the opposite sex and say they are much happier.

[Hilltop Customs]

Let me help.

Click on the edit button. And let the page load.
Next check the box that is labed "click here to delete thread"
Finally click the button that says "submit"

It may be rough instructions but it should accomplish what we both want.

There are two sides to every story, the TV will give you one, the other side well... isn't so obvious

I was ready to delete the thread after you posted, because there was no real discussion your post could lead to. Now there are people posting who show some type of interest to the thread, therefore it will stay unless mods feel it should be gone.

[Hilltop Customs]

Actually there are a great many gays who chose to leave that lifestyle and get married to the opposite sex and say they are much happier.

but is the happiness because of their new association with the opposite sex, or because they are no longer a "freak" in societies view? thats an important question, but there is no real way to answer it

[MANN]

IDK, ive honestly never had any homosexual feeling towards my friends......so I dont see my sexuality as a choice....its just the way I am.

I have debated this topic hundreds of thousands of times, and I have some gay people in my direct family

my .02 is
If no one chooses their sexuality then that would define for me that people don't choose the fetishes that they are in. (whatever that might be)

IMO if you allow that to slide by it would also include pedifiles (sp). After all they did not choose to like little children.

If my employer said that I need not run at work then I will not run. If my employer stated that I need not be gay then so be it. There is a place and time for everything. The army is not one of those places. If they want to be gay when they are out go for it. I completely understand the reason for not putting a gay guy in a platoon of straight men. Not only will it cause some people to be uncomfortable, but it would be unsafe for the gay person. Regardless how you look at it it is probally easier to spend 360 million than dealing with gay groups after someone hangs a gay person for making a pass on him/her.

It may not be right, but it is the right way to do it.

[wetwrks]

but is the happiness because of their new association with the opposite sex, or because they are no longer a "freak" in societies view? thats an important question, but there is no real way to answer it

Or are they simply happier with life in general? Does it really matter? They chose apple pie over cherry and decided they like life better that way. A choice.

[MANN]

going back to work on the ep sleeper mag. After this is closed if you want to discuss/debate some more we can take it to beo.

[wetwrks]

going back to work on the ep sleeper mag. After this is closed if you want to discuss/debate some more we can take it to beo.

LOL

[Hilltop Customs]

I would say he technically did go around flaunting it.



And someone had to aware of it otherwise he would still be in the military.

I also don't buy the "no choice" thing. Even if it is genetic, that doesn't make it acceptable. They (science) have found a genetic link for alcoholism. Must we accept that as an acceptable lifestyle (including driving drunk and all)? Same with a propensity towards spousal abuse and rape. What happens when (not if) they find a genetic propensity for pedafilia? Do we now have to accept that as a valid lifestyle?

Sorry but I cannot agree with that line of logic.

If there is really some genetic link, how is it passed down to children. anything that limits reproduction will eventually become dormant in genes.

side story...humans were all lactose intolerant years ago, then we started drinking dairy. The very few people who could digest dairy lived longer and had a greater probability of having kids. The kids could digest diary since it was in their genes, so they in turn lived lived longer and had more kids....rinse and repeat and now about ~80% of people can effectively digest dairy products.

So if homosexual tendencies are really genetic, since homosexuals are less likely to reproduce(not saying they cant, but are less likely....more likely to adopt counts) they would or will likely become dormant.

I'm not saying that it cant be in some ways genetic, but I think it has more to do with history, childhood, friends, and general upbringing.

[wetwrks]

The other side of this is that if their contract specifies don't ask, don't tell, then they have broken contract. If the military is spending massive amounts of money to remove these individuals then they should be responsible for those costs. They would be held responsible were it some other breach of contract.

[Drachen]

IDK, ive honestly never had any homosexual feeling towards my friends......so I dont see my sexuality as a choice....its just the way I am.

OR...
Maybe you have ugly friends? Just because you are attracted to the female gender, does that mean you're attracted to every single woman on the face of the Earth? Doubtful.

I also don't buy the "no choice" thing. Even if it is genetic, that doesn't make it acceptable. They (science) have found a genetic link for alcoholism. Must we accept that as an acceptable lifestyle (including driving drunk and all)? Same with a propensity towards spousal abuse and rape. What happens when (not if) they find a genetic propensity for pedafilia? Do we now have to accept that as a valid lifestyle?

Sorry but I cannot agree with that line of logic.

Exactly.


Now don't get me wrong, I don't neccisarily believe that they should kick gay people out of the military, simply for being gay. Though even as you said, Hilltop, the guy in the story you were talking about had, in a way, gone around flaunting the fact that he was. Even though it's VERY well known when it comes to the whole dispute between the military, and gays. Yet he still decided to let it be known that he's gay. What do you expect? That's basically asking for trouble. Even though he didn't go directly out, and tell everyone he's gay.

Besides, why are you getting so bent out of shape about this? Surely if the military really did spend 369 Million on this subject, you'd think they probably would have "wasted" money else where. Especially on things that matters more than whether or not gays are allowed in the Military. It's silly to get into an argument over things like this. Honestly, you're doing somewhat the same thing the guy in the military did, stirring up a hornets nest. Whether or not that's you're intention, you should've realized this post was going sour after the first couple of posts. Politics, Religion, and now Sexuality is things, most of the time, better left alone. Believe what you want, it gives you no right to try and push your beliefs on to others.