Assualt weapon ban voted down..

[Rooster]

"And Rooster Jungle warfare is a wee bit different then Urban."

Contrary to ignorant beliefs, the whole of the US isn't covered by cities. You are also assuming the whole military would back whomever was trying to crush an uprising. There are pleanty of places that tanks can't travel, and far more people than tanks. A tank is the same as useless as a firing platform in an urban setting.

So what was the point you never made?

[Koosh]

Originally posted by Rooster
Kerry destroyed a village of woman and children, and you don't call that questionable?

You mind letting me know where that was stated?

With my Dad being a Vietnam Vet (2 Purple Hearts, Silver Star and a Bronze Star among others), I take offense to that.

US Soldiers didn't kill and destroy for fun, no matter what the movies make you believe. IF that villiage was destroyed, there was probably a good reason for it at the time.

[Southpaw]

Evil evil bad stuff happens in war to deny that fact is VERY naive! In all wars Innocent people are killed and maimed. My father too was in the army, and my mom and dad work for the VAMC the stories that vets tell are unbelievable. Most make the movie Platoon look very tame!!

[Rooster]

"I take offense to that. "

And I take offense to people calling Kerry a war hero and Bush a draft dodger, especially when Kerry's record in Vietnam is questionable.

Don't throw stones when you live in a glass house.

[Mateo]

Originally posted by Sir_Brass



This is even supported historically . Anyone remember what happened to all those texans who stayed and fought at the alamo .

Amen. Took more than half the Mexican army. I dare ya to take away our guns communist bastards!

[Koosh]

Originally posted by Rooster
"I take offense to that. "

And I take offense to people calling Kerry a war hero and Bush a draft dodger, especially when Kerry's record in Vietnam is questionable.

Don't throw stones when you live in a glass house.

Thanks for not answering my question too.

I never called Kerry a war hero, but I certainly never called him a Baby Killer either.

I was simply asking where the hell you got the information that Kerry destroyed a villiage and killed women and children...

[Southpaw]

Try this kerry tells you himself!!! His I was orderd speech!

EDIT: He is a self admitted baby killer but he was just doing what everyone else did so thats OK is that who you want as President? I knew it was against the Geneva convention, but I didn't want to look like the Nancy boy that I am until I get back to the US.

[Konigballer]

guys, we used LOTS of tanks in Vietnam. Mostly M48 Pattons and M551 Sheridans. We used our whole conventional army to fight an unconventional war. They just wer'ent very effective in that enviornment.

FutureMagOwner got it right though, they were mostly used for infantry support and as a strike force to try and flush out more conventional NVA units to fight and kill.

TheFlamingKoosh, some US soldiers DID kill and destroy for fun in Vietnam. Just like some soldiers on all sides have done in every war.

Some people really LIKE war. My ucle Pat's one of them. He did three tours over there. He actually liked fighting, combats like a drug and it is well documented over several wars that a some proportion of soldiers on all sides love the adrenalin rush of combat and have no qualms about killing the enemy. If you've read Band of Brothers or seen the series you could probably include Lt. Spears in this bunch as an example. Their in every war. Its just that other wars had better PR coverage to obscure this from the folks at the homefront than Vietnam did, it was broadcasted on TV here every day.

[Rooster]

"but I certainly never called him a Baby Killer either. "

You should. Your little poster boy is everything your little party rails against. The only thing the Democrats have is a hatered of Bush. They lose on every single issue across the board. People are not in favor of gay marrige, they are not in favor of increased gun control, they are not in favor of increased taxes, and the war in Iraq was very popular.

This election will be very amusing, and I will take personal pleasure in reminding the moronic minority of their failings.

[Koosh]

"You should."

I just don't get it... I've never said that Kerry was "my boy", or hell I've never ONCE even made it clear that I'm voting democrat! I just didn't think its right for you to call a man who fought for our country a "baby killer"... its war man, this stuff happens.

What you are doing is pissing on every person who served in Vietnam by holding Kerry in contempt. He admitted what he did, and there are probably HUNDREDS if not thousands of servicemen who did the exact same thing. (thanks for the link Southpaw, thats what I was asking Rooster for)...

"and the war in Iraq was very popular "

So we can only cruicfy vet's of unpopular ones?

[Rooster]

Kerry could have carried a baby's head around on a pike for all I care. But I'm not a liberal. I'm not one of the people who moaned and wailed when we went to Iraq when a few civilians got hurt. Collateral damage doesn't bother me.

But if you are going to attack one man on his service record, be ready for a attack in kind. Bush's vietnam service is questionable. So is Kerry's. Both are as clean a snow falling on the interstate during rush hour. Just don't fool yourself into thinking Kerry is some kind of all american hero. He just as dirty as Bush, if not worse.

[Dragonfd3s]

how can u call serving in the natiional guard service, when his service is even questionable. Kerry went and fought in vietnam and bush hid behind his father in the reserves. bush is a coward, And why do u need an assault rifle. It is totally un-neccesary. Saying you need a assault rifle to target practice is just plain stupid. Use a hunting rifle.

So why do you need a semi automatic paintball gun when you can use a PGP or a Pump?

[shartley]

good thing. at least it shows congress isn't as liberal as we thought it was.

Now all that needs to be done to secure America for another 4 years is to see that Bush is reelected, and not that treasonous peace-nik Kerry.

Yeah - Vietnam veteran is treasonous and a peace-nik

Lets see...

Son of a volunteer WWII pilot flying DC 3.

A Swift Boat officer who serving on a gunboat in the Mekong Delta in Vietnam.

Recipient of a Silver Star, Bronze Star with Combat V, and three Purple Hearts for his service in combat.

But go ahead and label him as you see fit. Perhaps you call that 'supporting our troops'...

A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.

it means that I, as a US citizen, have a constitutional right to own guns. I dont want the king of England barging into my house telling me what do to, do you?

how can u call serving in the natiional guard service, when his service is even questionable. Kerry went and fought in vietnam and bush hid behind his father in the reserves. bush is a coward, And why do u need an assault rifle. It is totally un-neccesary. Saying you need a assault rifle to target practice is just plain stupid. Use a hunting rifle.

Kerry destroyed a village of woman and children, and you don't call that questionable?

Assualt rifles to me, seem like overkill, there just doesn't seem to be a practical use.

And what kind of paintball marker do you shoot? What is its ROF? Is it a pump marker? Stock Class?

Why would you need a assault rifle?! It has been proven that the sound of a shotgun being pumped will make anyone trying to break into a house turn around very quickly and leave. I wouldnt want a freakin assault rifle with high velocity rounds punching through walls in my house and killing my nextdoor neighbors in their sleep!!!!!

u can say wat u want but there will be a day when assault rifles will be band like they should be. And on the topic of bush i dont know how u can accuse kerry of being a baby killer. When bush goes and bombs iraq because they have weapons of mass destruction. WHERE ARE THEY?!?! oh yeah they didnt find any, isnt that funny, and its also peculiar how there is millions of drums of oil under iraq as well. Yah bush is a great president

No it wasn't. It was put there so that citizens couldn't be disarmed by their OWN government.

This is true, but it also covers invaders as well. But what a good deal of the Constitution is about is protection from OURSELVES (i.e. our own government). The founding fathers saw how power can corrupt and how easy it is to step on the rights of citizens, so they put in protections to prevent that from happening.

Nahh, I'd settle for McCain. I think the Republicans made a bad choice with Bush.

You mind letting me know where that was stated?

With my Dad being a Vietnam Vet (2 Purple Hearts, Silver Star and a Bronze Star among others), I take offense to that.

US Soldiers didn't kill and destroy for fun, no matter what the movies make you believe. IF that villiage was destroyed, there was probably a good reason for it at the time.

Try this kerry tells you himself!!! His I was orderd speech!

EDIT: He is a self admitted baby killer but he was just doing what everyone else did so thats OK is that who you want as President? I knew it was against the Geneva convention, but I didn't want to look like the Nancy boy that I am until I get back to the US.

[Stix]

Guns nessecary for freedom?

I hope I'm not getting in over my head on this, but some evolutionary biologists have proposed that in general, arms are nessecary for the propogation of freedom and democracy. He who has the guns controls the government basically. Sufferage, according to these biologists, correlates highly with the ability to fight back. A good example of this is Annie Oakely, teaching women in mass amounts how to shoot all kinds of guns. And during this revolution, guess what? Women acquired sufferage.

On a smaller scale, taking a look at small tribes around the world, basically the only members that can participate in government are the ones that can handle the atatl, bow and arrow, etc. In more advanced tribes, everyone has arms such as these, and guess what? They all participate in governance...

The reverse is true as well, take guns away and the government brings on the smack down. Take pre-Nazi Germany for instance. All gun owning citizens were required to register w/ the government (A very similar bill was put forth by Bill Clinton; thankfully it was struck down). When it came time for war, using these records, Nazi regieme came and took all firearms away from it's citizens so no one could resist. When the Communists took over China, what did they do? Take all the guns away... the list goes on.

It is interesting to note that dictatorships are always displayed to the public with weapons of war. Look at the statues of the old Caesars and Emperor's of Japan. They are always in war regalia; some believe this is to remind their slaves that they hold the keys to life and death. A more modern day example would be Saddam Hussien almost always appearing in a military outfit or shooting off some sort of firearm. Democratic governmental leaders would never display themselves as such. Why? It is proposed that because if they did, we might shoot them =)

Any thoughts? I figured since we are on the topic already I'd just throw this up for discussion.

[Stix]

Correct me if I'm wrong...

I was under the impression that you would rather have a high powered pistol to protect yourself in your home. A long rifle would be rather unwieldy in a CQB situation. Crooks have long stated that they would rather go against a man w/ a big as rifle he had swing around then a guy with a pistol that could line up shots faster.

I also thought getting shot by a handgun in close range sucks more, mainly because

1. The bullet doesn't alway come out
2. The bullet if it does come out, comes out as a big flatened mass that makes a big *** exit wound.
3. Rifles go out cleaner at close range.

Is this right?