If you love Paintball....

[kosmo]

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[Mango]

Any firearm without a licence or unregistered.

Great thanks, you just caused every rifle in New Jersey to be confiscated.

This is not that simple, and like Phil said, in many states there is no requirement to "register" your firearm. Also, a License allows the buyer/seller to purchase firearms from dealers LEGALLY. Do you think criminals go to their local police stations, fill out the required papers and pay the $50 or $100, get fingerprinted, get put into databases, have their pictures taken digitally (in NJ now) and put into a FEDERAL database, wait 3 months, then get their license and go to a LEGAL gun shop to buy a weapon?

I'll give you the answer in case you stopped reading:

NO.


Phil and I are on the same page on this topic. The only people stricter gun laws hurt....are the honest citizen. This is the truth. We are the easiest target since we follow the rules (mostly) and have to jump through hoops just to own a firearm. Here in NJ, we have it the worst.

[Ole Unka Phil]

Another thing thats going on here... many states are having to introduce and pass what is normaly called "the Emergency Powers Protection Act" preventing local governments from confiscating lawfully-owned firearms during a declared state of emergency, as we witnessed in New Orleans following Hurricane Katrina. Yes, the local governemnt ordered the law Enforcement and Gaurd to go house to house and disarm them DURING AN EMERGENCY WHERE POLICE RESPONSE WAS ALMOST IMPOSSIBLE! They should have had no right to do so. Leaving them defenseless to the looters. They took them and, even after being ordered to return them by the courts, they still have them. And funny thing is, only the law abiding people gave them up! No crimial admitted to having one and surrendered it. Why would they? So now many states have had to go back and pass laws DISALLOWING thier governments the ability to disarm in emergencies least this be repeated. Mayor Nagan should be jailed for this act. But he doesn't really know what he is doing anyhow.

Mango is right, NJ sucks but not as bad as NY city and Washington DC. Two places you probably SHOULD be armed. California varies from place to place but overall is not too good. Vermont, oddly enough, and Alaska may be the best. Note that since the Personal Protection Acts swept in after 1995, Many states now have Concealed Weapons Permit processes and people can go through the process and get a license to carry and many have. And nothing bad has happened because of it. Good people do not cause problems. It's been well proven in practice now. Been tested for 10 years.

[psychowarden]

It won't pass, it goes against our constitution, thus instantly making it void.

[Pneumagger]

Great thanks, you just caused every rifle in New Jersey to be confiscated.

This is not that simple, and like Phil said, in many states there is no requirement to "register" your firearm. Also, a License allows the buyer/seller to purchase firearms from dealers LEGALLY. Do you think criminals go to their local police stations, fill out the required papers and pay the $50 or $100, get fingerprinted, get put into databases, have their pictures taken digitally (in NJ now) and put into a FEDERAL database, wait 3 months, then get their license and go to a LEGAL gun shop to buy a weapon?

I'll give you the answer in case you stopped reading:

NO.


Phil and I are on the same page on this topic. The only people stricter gun laws hurt....are the honest citizen. This is the truth. We are the easiest target since we follow the rules (mostly) and have to jump through hoops just to own a firearm. Here in NJ, we have it the worst.

Most states aren't nearly as strict as NJ either though. There is NO wait or liscense to purchase ay firearm or assault weapon in Ohio. No fingerprinting, no backround check, and CCW is legal with a minor permit. These laws apply to all dealers as well as trade shows and pawn shops.

About 30 of the 50 states operate this loosly. This list is load of BS, and without any more evidence to support this cause other than a radical list circulated almost a deade ago, I'mna call shens on that one.

And for the record, paintball markers aren't guns, nor do the vast majority of them look like guns.
Squirt guns?
Nintendo Light guns?
FPS Video Games (toys with virtual guns)?

[emumikey]

It won't pass, it goes against our constitution, thus instantly making it void.

Thats how amendments happen, sport

This legislation is rediculous to begin with, although I do agree with some of the policies. The problem is it will only have a major impact on the law abiding citizens, who are not the problem when it comes to gun control.

[skife]

If this happens, the government will be overthrown.
i belive its getting to powerful as it is.

[Ole Unka Phil]

Most states aren't nearly as strict as NJ either though. There is NO wait or liscense to purchase ay firearm or assault weapon in Ohio. No fingerprinting, no backround check, and CCW is legal with a minor permit. These laws apply to all dealers as well as trade shows and pawn shops.

About 30 of the 50 states operate this loosly. This list is load of BS, and without any more evidence to support this cause other than a radical list circulated almost a deade ago, I'mna call shens on that one.

And for the record, paintball markers aren't guns, nor do the vast majority of them look like guns.
Squirt guns?
Nintendo Light guns?
FPS Video Games (toys with virtual guns)?

You Sir are totaly ignorant of Ohio laws. Here is the requirements to get a Concealed Weapons Permit in Ohio

You will need to:

* Submit an application (provided by the Sheriff free of charge)
* Provide a photo taken within 30 days of applying
* Submit an original or photocopy of a certificate of completion of a firearm safety class
* Read the state's pamphlet on deadly force (provided)
* Provide fingerprints to be taken by the Sheriff's office equipment

Notes:

* Initial training must be less than three years old
* Renewal training must be within the last six years
* The color photo (front view, head and shoulders, substantially similar to a 2-inch-by-2- inch passport photo) taken within 30 days of the application date accompany the completed application.

Issuing authority

Date updated: Jul 28, 2005 @ 11:14 pm

All licenses to carry a concealed handgun shall be issued by the elected Sheriffs of Ohio's 88 counties. You may apply at the Sheriff of the county that you live in, or, you may choose to apply with the Sheriff of any county adjacent to the county that you live in.

There are absolutely no non-resident licenses in the State of Ohio at this time. You must be a resident to obtain an Ohio license to carry a concealed handgun.

No on here considers Paintball Markers to be Firearms. But the Postal Service does.... and these Anti Gun people do... and they intend to outlaw them as well. They are not their primary target but they want anything that looks like a gun to be gone. For some reason you will have to ask them to try and explain to you. They made up this list of priorities.... not I.

By the way... MOST states require background checks and finger prints of anyone getting a CWP. And most states require a NICS check before purhcasing a firearm. And there is no such thing as an "Assault Weapon". Its a made up term. They don't really exist except to scare people with term. They are a mythical monster created by anti gun people.

[AZ_09]

Crap, ill be 17 in 2008.
It probably would be bad if the guns were taken away.

Personaly, i think if a country declared war on the USA, and they tried to invade, it wouldnt happen. The military, first off would be the main stopper, BUT, think of all the NRA people, and everyone with guns. The invaders would have so much trouble going through cities.

I know if someone was invading, and they were in my city, i would go out and try to stop them.

If they take the guns away, we keep sending more and more troops overseas, and keep less inside the USA, if it ever happened, an invasion would be hard to stop. It would be an invite to a massive attack from terrorists.


Ok now, i know someone will disagree with me.

[Glickman]

Crap, ill be 17 in 2008.
It probably would be bad if the guns were taken away.

Personaly, i think if a country declared war on the USA, and they tried to invade, it wouldnt happen. The military, first off would be the main stopper, BUT, think of all the NRA people, and everyone with guns. The invaders would have so much trouble going through cities.

Ok now, i know someone will disagree with me.

you know how you leave practicing medicine to the doctors?

leave the shooting to the armed forces/national guard


The problem I see is someone trying to pull what bush has been pulling; that is slipping these little regulations in as a sub topic of a main bill, so chances are it goes by unnoticed.

It won't pass, it goes against our constitution, thus instantly making it void.

since when has the law stopped the government before?

[Ole Unka Phil]

Crap, ill be 17 in 2008.
It probably would be bad if the guns were taken away.

Personaly, i think if a country declared war on the USA, and they tried to invade, it wouldnt happen. The military, first off would be the main stopper, BUT, think of all the NRA people, and everyone with guns. The invaders would have so much trouble going through cities.

I know if someone was invading, and they were in my city, i would go out and try to stop them.

If they take the guns away, we keep sending more and more troops overseas, and keep less inside the USA, if it ever happened, an invasion would be hard to stop. It would be an invite to a massive attack from terrorists.


Ok now, i know someone will disagree with me.

Your thinking now. Yea.. some cities would be unarmed and are unarmed. And another reason for the 2nd amendment was to establish Militia's. Both organized (State Gaurd) and unorganized (every person capable of bearing arms) for protection of the State. Thats also the reason for that amendment was to make sure those could be Armed in case of need. Drawing from each individual that had a gun made that easier if each did. The other concept was that the Federation (federal government) would keep no standing Army in times of Peace. In order to never be able to employ it against its people. Which is why we see draw downs in times of peace and more reliance on State and National Guards (Militia's). However the Federal government often uses various excuses to maintain a fairly heavy standing army. Such as "when are we really at peace"? and "it would be too dangerous to draw way down as getting back up and organized would leave us vulnerable in that period". All of which have some validity. So its probably NOT a good idea to not have some sort of Federal Military organization all the time but still.... that was the Constitutional intent was to not have one. To not allow one to be able to be used to put down the will of the people.... Some interesting stuff on that back in the Articles of the Federation. The precursor to the constitution. It gets into great detail about that sort of thing.

[iambored]

Your thinking now. Yea.. some cities would be unarmed and are unarmed. And another reason for the 2nd amendment was to establish Militia's. Both organized (State Gaurd) and unorganized (every person capable of bearing arms) for protection of the State. Thats also the reason for that amendment was to make sure those could be Armed in case of need. Drawing from each individual that had a gun made that easier if each did. The other concept was that the Federation (federal government) would keep no standing Army in times of Peace. In order to never be able to employ it against its people. Which is why we see draw downs in times of peace and more reliance on State and National Guards (Militia's). However the Federal government often uses various excuses to maintain a fairly heavy standing army. Such as "when are we really at peace"? and "it would be too dangerous to draw way down as getting back up and organized would leave us vulnerable in that period". All of which have some validity. So its probably NOT a good idea to not have some sort of Federal Military organization all the time but still.... that was the Constitutional intent was to not have one. To not allow one to be able to be used to put down the will of the people.... Some interesting stuff on that back in the Articles of the Federation. The precursor to the constitution. It gets into great detail about that sort of thing.

This quote is worthy of QFT and Troof

[Lohman446]

And for the record, paintball markers aren't guns, nor do the vast majority of them look like guns.

Oh

8.3T "Firearm" defined
Sec. 3t. the word "firearm", except as otherwise specifically defined in the statutes, shall be construed to include any weapon from which a dangerous projectile may be propelled by using explosives, gas, or air as a means of propulsion, except any smooth bore rifle or handgun designed and manufactured exclusively for propelling BB's not exceeding .177 calibre by means of spring, gas, or air.

600.2951 (b) "Pistol" means a firearm, loaded or unloaded, 30 inches or less in legth, or any firearm, loaded or unloaded, which by its construction and appearance conceals it as a firearm.

750.82 Felenious assault
Sec. 82 (1) Except as provided in subsection (2) [Note: subsection 2 deals with a weapons free school zone and harsher penalties, I have not included it here], a person who assaults another person with a gun, revolver, pistol, knife, iron bar, club, brass knuckles, or other dangerous weapon without intending to commit murder or to inflict great bodily harm less than murder is guilty of a felony punishable by improsonment for not more than 4 years or a fine of not more than 2,000.00, or both

750.171 Engaging in or challenging to fight duel.
Sec 171. Engaging in or challenging to fight a duel - Any person who shall engage in a duel with any deadly , although no homicide enuse, or who shall challenge another to fight such a duel, or shall send or deliver any written or verbal message, purporting or intended to such challenge, although no duel ensue, shall be guilty of a felony, punishable by imprisonment in the state prison not more than 10 years or by a fine of not more than 5,000 dollars, and shall also be incapable of holding or of being elected or appointed to any place of honor, profit, or trust, under the constitution or laws of this state.

750.222
Sec. 222 as used in this chapter
(b) "Barrel length" means the internal lenght of a firarm as measured form the face of the closed breech of the firearm when it is unloaded, to the forward face of the end of the barrel.
(e) "Pistol" means a loaded or unloaded firearm that is 30 inches or less in length, or al oaded or unloaded firearm that by its construction and appearance concels itself as a firearm.
(i) "Short barreled shotgun" means a shotgun having 1 or more barrles less than 18 inches in length or a weapon made from a shotugne, wheter by alteration, modification or otherwise, if the weapon as modified has ano verall lenght of less than 26 inches.
(K) "Short barrled rifle" means a rifle having 1 or more barrels less than 16 inches in length or a weapon made from a rfiel, whether by alteration, modification, or otherwise, i the weapon as modified has an overall lenght of less than 26

750.223 Selling firearms and ammunitons:...
Sec 223 (2) A persone who knowingly sells a firearm more than 30 inches in length to a person under 18 years of age is guilty of a misdeameanor, punishable by imprisonment for not more than 90 days, or a fine of not more than $500.00, or both. A second or subsequent violation of this subsection is a felony punishable by imprisonment for not more than 4 years, or a fine of not more than $2,000.oo or both. It is an affirmative defense to a prosecution under this subsection that the person who sold the fireamr asked to see and was shown a driver's liscence or identification card issued by a state that identified the purchaser being 18 years of age or older.

750.224b Short barrled shotgun or rifle...
Sec 224b (1) A person shall nto manufacture, sell,offer for sale, or possesss a short barreled shotgun or a short barreld rifle.
2) A person who violates this section is guitly of a felony punishable by imprisonment for not more than 5 years, or a finde of not more than $2,500.00, or both.


750.235 Firearm; injuring, intentionally aimed without malice.
Sec 23. Injuring by discharging of a fire-arm intentionally but without malice pointed at another - Any person who shall maim or injure any other person by the discharge of any fire-arm pointed or aimed intentionally, without malice, at any suchperson shall be guitly of a misdeamonor, punishable by imprisonment in the county jail not more than 1 year or by a fine of not more than 500 dollars.

752.861 Careless, reckless, or negligent use of firearms, penalty.
Sec 1. Any person who, because of carelessness, recklessness, or negligence, but not willfully or wantonly, shall cause or allow any fireamr under his immediate control, to be discharged so as to kill or injure another person, shall be guilty of a misdemeanor, punishable by imprsionment in the state prison for not more than 2 years, or b a fine of not more than 2,000.00., or by improsonment in the county jal for not more than 1 year, in the discretion of the court.

Now, we can argue over the word dangerous, but I think in the event of injury dangerous would be pretty hard to fight.

[Ole Unka Phil]

Here is your daily reading assignment

http://lneilsmith.org/am-i-nra.html

And for those of you who can't or won't read...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bg_gmSHu-h4

[wimag]

is there an actual amendment / resolution on the table that this pertains too ? sounds sketchy.