A marketing idea for AGD

[Marek]

And which point that he was trying to make had merit? I don't no about anyone else, but the reason I brought anything up was the fact that the rt valve was "outdated." I'm sorry, but there is no proof of that statement, and when I brought it up again, lets not make it personal.

Stick by your words and back them up, or don't say anything at all.

[Koosh]

What most people are forgetting is that right now most guns are probably sold to people without knowledge of AO or paintball on the internet... so what sells them? LOCAL DEALORS!

And 9 times out of 10, the local pro shop will add the parts necessary (A barrel and a bottomline) to make it a complete gun...

What AGD can do to help sell more higher end classic valves would be to add a drop down menu system on the website... Like it gives you options for what valve, rail, body, gripframe, optional barrels, and air lines and with ULT or LX, uninstalled... having to install all those probably wouldn't make it worth while.

But thats just my idea, I'll leave the GOOD ideas to people that actually know what they are talking about... and suprisingly there haven't been as many as there should be in this thread...

[thei3ug]

we're going to play the logic game now? Everyone take a post personally and say "Well, since I didn't say x, no one else did either?"

I'm judging you (not us, not in this one, I'm not having a part in it at all) as a community. And I'm going to repeat myself, this thread is rediculous.

[Frederic]

For those not uber-loyal to AGD, i.e.: the average consumer, the price for number of upgrades you want for a gun can really add up. When I was debating between an emag and a viking, the emag required me to separately buy a lvl x and install it properly. Not to mention getting a right feed gun to use all of my already existing mag barrels or shelling out a significant sum to get vertical feed and use cocker barrels.

In the end, the viking was cheaper (than the stock emag alone) and less hassle since it was ready to go, and it won out.

No1BeefCake's point as I see it is that if AGD made their guns with what the average tourney-level consumer would want and made it competitively priced (ie: not need to shell out $230 more for LVLX and ULE body), more people would be swayed over in the rather competitive market.

Sure, when you say this in the Church of the Mag, it's blasphemy. But when you say this in the market place, it's just common (not to mention good business) sense.

[Grasshopper]

I think that AGD should try to add some "flash" to their guns/website. Look at the difference between the Black Magik picture, and the RT Pro picture. The RT has a white background with an orange circle. Then, take a look at the BM. It's flashy, looks cool, and that's what makes it sell (not that alone, but it's a factor). Many, many, many of the people that are wanting to buy a gun, want it to look "cool".

If AGD could try to "spice" up their website, and and sell things in a package (ULE, rail, I-frame, etc), so that the picture could have a cool lookin' gun that people would want to buy, then they'd sell more. Once they start selling a cool lookin' gun, that looks nice in the picture, at a reasonable price, then the 'Mag sales will increase. Once more people start actually shooting 'Mags, dealers will pick more 'Mag stuff up. Eventually, 'Mags could become something that you normally see at a field again.

I'm not really sure what everyone here at AO wants, but if I was looking for a high-end mech marker, and saw a picture of an already put together, cool looking 'Mag, it'd sway me to buy it much more than looking at a picture of a Classic, then a picture of a ULE, then a picture of an X-valve, etc.

My two pennies.

[shartley]

Originally posted by Grasshopper
I think that AGD should try to add some "flash" to their guns/website. Look at the difference between the Black Magik picture, and the RT Pro picture. The RT has a white background with an orange circle. Then, take a look at the BM. It's flashy, looks cool, and that's what makes it sell (not that alone, but it's a factor). Many, many, many of the people that are wanting to buy a gun, want it to look "cool".

If AGD could try to "spice" up their website, and and sell things in a package (ULE, rail, I-frame, etc), so that the picture could have a cool lookin' gun that people would want to buy, then they'd sell more. Once they start selling a cool lookin' gun, that looks nice in the picture, at a reasonable price, then the 'Mag sales will increase. Once more people start actually shooting 'Mags, dealers will pick more 'Mag stuff up. Eventually, 'Mags could become something that you normally see at a field again.

I'm not really sure what everyone here at AO wants, but if I was looking for a high-end mech marker, and saw a picture of an already put together, cool looking 'Mag, it'd sway me to buy it much more than looking at a picture of a Classic, then a picture of a ULE, then a picture of an X-valve, etc.

My two pennies.

[tony3]

Originally posted by no1beefcake


First of all, let's make this a little less personal. We're talking about ways AGD can improve its marketing, and yes, a new standard, stock body every decade or so would definitely help.

Secondly, to get one thing out of the way, Here is my primary Marker:

Yes, it is an old school, 10 pound chunk of stainless steel that isn't horribly accurate, or horribly fast, or horribly good looking, but I love it, and it doesn't break. The quality of AGD's products haven't been in question. To me, however, their lower end markers are just not competing in their demographic, and in order to be a successful company, you must have a bread-and-butter base product to sell a good quantity. Your sales chart should pyramid, with the most sales going to your cheapest marker, and tapering off with your most expensive.

Also, in paintball, we know that aethetics do, in fact, matter greatly. From the military styled Tippmanns to the racy Angels, all of the markers on the shelf appeal to a different type. I think AGDs goal should be to appeal to every level of consumer, from beginner, to intermediate, to pro.

Until AGD makes a base level, updated marker to replace the Classic 68, they're going to be disappointed with their sales. That is just the way it is. All arguments aside, I think that the past will show that innovation should start at the top, and filter down to the lower products. It doesn't cost AGD much (if any) more to put a Level 10 on a Classic Mag, instead of the current. And hell, why not make a stock barrel that is included, and that isn't horrible? Tippmann does it, WGP does it, why not AGD? I know it HAS to cost less to make the ULE body than the old SS honkers, so throw those on as well.

The company shouldn't have to rely on a $700 or $1300 paintgun to keep them afloat in the market, because the average paintballer isn't going to pass up all the GREAT markers in the 300-500 dollar range to get there. AGD enthusiasts? Yes. A guy looking for the best value for his hard earned dollar? No.

Wise words, from a wise man, good job beefcake, you are thinking the exact same things as me.

[thei3ug]

Originally posted by RogueFactor


Where did you say those words the first time?

forgive me if i chose to paraphrase, but I thought my first post wasn't enough to the point.

How about "I've noticed the fanatacism getting to the point where true criticism is ignored and attacked," not from me, but hey, maybe I should have just left it at that rather than open myself up to criticism.

Or let's just make the background on a jpeg better, that will sell for sure.

[no1beefcake]

Originally posted by Marek
And which point that he was trying to make had merit? I don't no about anyone else, but the reason I brought anything up was the fact that the rt valve was "outdated." I'm sorry, but there is no proof of that statement, and when I brought it up again, lets not make it personal.

Stick by your words and back them up, or don't say anything at all.

Ok, let's just put it this way, the RT valve is outdated like my dual 1ghz G4. It still is nice, and still gets the job done, but it isn't like a new G5 (or X-valve) and should be priced accordingly. The RTPro shouldn't be 3 times as expensive as the Classic. It should be moved down, and the classic should be phased out...

[no1beefcake]

Re: ...

Originally posted by RogueFactor


What thread are you reading?

Beefcake first posted here in response to a post I made with actual monetary figures, and made an accusation that "my thinking was flawed", or didnt you read that post?

No cult needed to jump on him. Between him and a few others, they come up with an arbitrary number($350) with no factual basis for it.

I havent seen a shouting match. Quite the opposite---I have seen beefcake change his arguments and play semantics himself, and twist his own words around.

Let me know if you would like me to go thru his posts and show you his inconsistencies, semantics, and word-twisting.

And your right, it is sick...that someone could say its a *conspiracy* of the AO cult to jump on a guy who makes unfounded statements and is then held to the standard of backing them up.

You still fail to understand how your thinking is indeed flawed. The retail price (the price that you posted for all of those individual parts that you have to buy to make a decent Mag) of those items is at a HUGE markup for AGD, and a single marker with all of those included should be at a price much lower than the combination of all of those parts. I already responded to this flawed concept in thinking by equating it to a car, in that the sum of all the separate parts would be much more expensive than just buying the finished product. I guess you just didn't understand.

Also, none of my statements were unfounded. The title of this thread is "A marketing idea for AGD" and all of my ideas have been about marketing, for AGD. I would LOVE for you to show me the "semantics and word twisting," please...

[Frederic]

The classic valve should not be done away with since there are plenty of people restricted to using CO2 and RT valves allegedly cannot handle CO2.

The thing that bothers me is that to get a LVL X + ULE body, you end up with two bodies and two bolts. The option to get it all for less than separate (and all installed professionally by AGD) would be a boon for business in the long run. For those sold on AGD no matter what they do, they'll lose money on these folk.

[Marek]

Originally posted by no1beefcake
Ok, let's just put it this way, the RT valve is outdated like my dual 1ghz G4. It still is nice, and still gets the job done, but it isn't like a new G5 (or X-valve) and should be priced accordingly. The RTPro shouldn't be 3 times as expensive as the Classic. It should be moved down, and the classic should be phased out...

There is no difference in the performance of an RT valve and an X-Valve. The weight difference is like 3 oz. Fine, X-valves come with lvl. 10, but that is not in the mix. What is in the mix, is the fact that you're trying to justify why you say that the rt is outdated. Again, there is no proof to that statement, no matter how you try and twist your words around.

Same valve there, and RT Pros come with X-valves and lvl. 10 now.

[no1beefcake]

Originally posted by Frederic
The classic valve should not be done away with since there are plenty of people restricted to using CO2 and RT valves allegedly cannot handle CO2.

The thing about it is, the Classic valves don't handle CO2 very well either (without a nice x-chamber, and anti-syphon)

[no1beefcake]

Originally posted by Marek


There is no difference in the performance of an RT valve and an X-Valve. The weight difference is like 3 oz. Fine, X-valves come with lvl. 10, but that is not in the mix. What is in the mix, is the fact that you're trying to justify why you say that the rt is outdated. Again, there is no proof to that statement, no matter how you try and twist your words around.

Same valve there, and RT Pros come with X-valves and lvl. 10 now.

You just stated the evidence right there. No level 10, it's heavier, and it won't handle CO2. Yes, it'll recharge really fast, but it's no longer the latest or greatest, but it still carries a latest and greatest pricetag.

[xatle]

Originally posted by no1beefcake


The thing about it is, the Classic valves don't handle CO2 very well either (without a nice x-chamber, and anti-syphon)

for years i ran a standard 20 oz verticle bottle without any trouble at all. even now that i use hpa i keep a verticle asa on my classic so that in the event im stuck useing co2 i can just yank off the drop forward and screw in a co2 tank.