We Want A PneuMag Frame!!! Email PTP Campaign

[Thordic]

Its hard to help PTP turn around their automag market when at present they don't make any mag products worth buying.

We're hoping this new frame changes that.

[frontrunner]

I'm not buying from ptp i don't care if they are the only one who make a frame of this kind. I will not support a nazi company no SP ans now no PTP. because these compaines fail to see what it does to the sport it leaves us hanging a frame like this could have been out in july but they want to play game with each other and what does it do? it hold of the realease and it will drive up the price of the frame for 2 reason 1 its expensive to play leagal games and thats coming out of your poket and 2 if now one else makes one you'll pay what they ask. so thanks ptp for joining sp in compaines that care more about money then your buyers

[teufelhunden]

I'm not buying from ptp i don't care if they are the only one who make a frame of this kind. I will not support a nazi company no SP ans now no PTP. because these compaines fail to see what it does to the sport it leaves us hanging a frame like this could have been out in july but they want to play game with each other and what does it do? it hold of the realease and it will drive up the price of the frame for 2 reason 1 its expensive to play leagal games and thats coming out of your poket and 2 if now one else makes one you'll pay what they ask. so thanks ptp for joining sp in compaines that care more about money then your buyers

I only quoted this message because of how STUPID it is, so that even if you edit it, it's still here.


PTP and SP are two _completely_ different issues. The problem everybody has with SP is that they expanded their Shocker patent to cover all electronic guns well after electros had permeated the market. Many people feel this was done illegally/in a manner that should not have been allowed by the USPTO. It was not SP protecting something they built, but instead a business move, which is where many people fault them. PTP is protecting something they've been working on for five years, although most of that was patent stuff.

PTP is not playing games with you. If anything, Deadlywind is the one playing games with the consumer by releasing videos of the hAir before it was ready and there were proper measures taken to be sure the product could make it to market. PTP did the opposite and took the correct route, patenting their idea before releasing anything about it. DW failed to do the correct thing and check with the patent office, especially considering a pneumatic assist trigger frame is not a new idea. DW was simply the first to release a video of a good implementation of it.

PTP didn't play any legal games. They patented their product and protect it. Not a game. Secondly, supply and demand dictates the price. Nobody is going to pay $400 for this frame because there's electros available for less.


Your entire post is baseless and without merit. People complain about the business of paintball being what's bad about paintball today-- no. Ignorant people spouting off on the internet is what's wrong with paintball today. You spew whatever comes to mind without rhyme or reason, fail to check the truth of your statements, and then pass them off as if God handed them to you on stone. Then people read the thread once and see your post before they see an intelligent and factual reply and assume your baseless statements are fact. YOU RUIN PAINTBALL, NOT BUSINESS.

[minimag03]

Why can't Deadlywind make a deal with PTP? It would save PTP a lot of money and time designing, plus it would increrase sales. It would help Deadlywind's work pay off too.

[cphilip]

Note: If you want to be a pessimist, do it somewhere else. We are trying to accomplish something positive here. So shut it.

Who died and made you King?

No one has to shut up. Anyones oppinion is welcome. You can ignore the ones you don't like....

[teufelhunden]

Who died and made you King?

I did, Phil, sorry I forgot to get that memo to ya..

[bunker17]

guys chill out no reason to fight

[RRfireblade]

Its hard to help PTP turn around their automag market when at present they don't make any mag products worth buying.

We're hoping this new frame changes that.

I think your miss understanding the situation, PTP and everyone else in the industry BTW, no longer makes Mag parts 'cause there currently IS no Mag market. Not the other way around. And don't think a Pnuematic Mag trigger is going to change that either.YOU the buyer need to buy more mag stuff and create the demand.When stuff stops selling,stuff stops getting made.Currently Mag sales of prettty much any kind account for less than 1% of the total in PB sales annually for at least the last 10 quarters. Ask Tom why he gave up the good fight then get back to me. It wasn't 'cause of an expected boom in Mag futures. :)

so thanks ptp for joining sp in compaines that care more about money then your buyers

Sure, No problem. Companies as a whole are only here to serve your personal selfish needs.We just pay our bills with huggs,dried flowers and good thoughts.

[bunker17]

Well fireblade you have point there that maybe mag sales are almost none existend but that doesn't mean that we shouldn' get products because there are still players who want them and the fact that we are always put to second place just because it doesn't generates sells well maybe the fact that all the third party companies throw everything the other side if you guyd would throw the pneumatic trigger first to the automag community im sure i have a cople 40 clients that would buy and entire gun which whatever pneumatic assisted frame would came out because i started selling mags because of the demand just from the advertisement of the hair so if it would have actually come out i would probably even sold 5 times what i did so why don't you give us a chance for a change.

We just pay our bills with huggs,dried flowers and good thoughts. and if you can pay your bills like that what is the point of getting money anyway then

[DiSoRdeR]

Does this mean that there will possibly be Micromags available again? If so would it be a current version or a new one? Either way Im interested.

[Muzikman]

DW obviously thought there was a big enough market for a new Mag frame or else they wouldn't have put so much time and money into it.

I don't think Tom bailed because the mag's future was grim. I think he bailed because of the industry it's self. If the future was so grim, why would Zupe even bother buying up the inventory and try to keep AGD alive?

There is a good fight out there, just we as players need to make sure the indutry stays in check.

I also think that with some of the rumors of rule changes, a fast mechanical gun might be the way to go. So this frame very well might have saved the mag, but we will never know now.

[teufelhunden]

Well fireblade you have point there that maybe mag sales are almost none existend but that doesn't mean that we shouldn' get products because there are still players who want them and the fact that we are always put to second place just because it doesn't generates sells well maybe the fact that all the third party companies throw everything the other side if you guyd would throw the pneumatic trigger first to the automag community im sure i have a cople 40 clients that would buy and entire gun which whatever pneumatic assisted frame would came out because i started selling mags because of the demand just from the advertisement of the hair so if it would have actually come out i would probably even sold 5 times what i did so why don't you give us a chance for a change.

We just pay our bills with huggs,dried flowers and good thoughts. and if you can pay your bills like that what is the point of getting money anyway then

Unfortunately, you're wrong. As I said above, you deserve nothing, and you are owed nothing. No company is going to drop the capital to bring products to the 'Mag market to sell 200 of them. It's too bad AGD isn't public, so I could show you all the annual reports.

These are still businesses. Do you see Nabisco making food products for every single person with different food intolerances? No. Ford doesn't make cars whose driver's seats go 4 feet back because the cost outweighs the demand. A 'Mag pneu frame is not out now and is probably not a front burner issue because the demand isn't there. AO is NOT all of paintball. AO is a group of 'Mag owners who say they'll buy products.. provided they're sold at cost, out before a user-set deadline, reliable... and unfortunatley, the 150 guys on here who promise to buy a product will result in 50 sales, and that's not enough to cover even initial cost, let alone make a profit. Which is the goal of any business. Behind PTP are people with families who need to make money to support their families, so giving you top notch high quality produt for pennies isn't something they can afford to do, let alone want to do.

So get off PTP's balls and let them go. Don't waste Jay's time sending 400,000 emails, because that's more money PTP has to pay him to do something other than invent/produce stuff. If PTP's Pneu-Mag frame comes out, awesome. If it doesn't come out, then make another thread, but move on with your life and find another option. All you have to blame is the people who always say they'll buy something if produced and then leave the producer on his butt when he drops a few grand in initial cost and then loses all of it... and the lack of 'Mag sales since electros hit the scene.

[teufelhunden]

DW obviously thought there was a big enough market for a new Mag frame or else they wouldn't have put so much time and money into it.

I don't think Tom bailed because the mag's future was grim. I think he bailed because of the industry it's self. If the future was so grim, why would Zupe even bother buying up the inventory and try to keep AGD alive?

There is a good fight out there, just we as players need to make sure the indutry stays in check.

I also think that with some of the rumors of rule changes, a fast mechanical gun might be the way to go. So this frame very well might have saved the mag, but we will never know now.

I believe DW was looking to expand the hAir into other types of markers as well, but don't hold me to that.

We can't say one way or another about the future of AGD without seeing the accounting reports, so I'll leave that one there.

And why have a fast mechanical that's semi when you can go 1-2-3-auto to the BPS cap?

[Muzikman]

Rumor has it that there is no cap on manual guns. So if you can fire an manual gun faster than the cap, you are golden. This is just the rumor and we'll see when the season starts.

[cphilip]

I did, Phil, sorry I forgot to get that memo to ya..

Oh! I stand corrected!!!



Lets just tone down the rude and nasty and discuss this like friends....