Gutter ball for "Bowling for Columbine"! (long)

[CasingBill]

Squid

First of all I would really be interested in where you get your statistics. According to FBI stats, over 98% of legal guns will not be used in commiting a crime. I carry a semi-automatic handgun because of my work, where I work and what I carry at work. If someone is going to rob me I am going to make every effort to shoot before I'm shot. A fellow business owner was shot dead only a block away from me last year. Although I don't expect to be robbed it would be foolish for me to not be prepared.

Now let me ask you this. Although you are only 16 answer this. IF you were married and had kids and while you were sleeping some night, someone broke into your house. This person has a gun. He wants to rape your wife, kill you and kill your kids. What are you going to do? Call 911??? By the time they get there you will already be dead.

Take the case in Brooklyn several months ago. This same type of event did happen. The intruder was shot inside a little boys bedroom by the boys father. Unluckily he was only wounded. The very presence of gun ownership deters crime.

[CasingBill]

Try these numbers on for size

I have no idea where you got your stats from but this is from the Bureau of Justice Statistics

The FBI's Crime in the United States estimated that 66% of the 15,517 murders in 2000 were committed with firearms.

How do you get 300000 murders by gun if there were only 15,517 in on year???? And only 66% were from firearms!!!

[Miscue]

An MM documentary perhaps?

Well... murders don't count all accidental deaths... justified shootings... etc...

Still a long ways to 30,000 I'd imagine, after tallying it all up.

[CasingBill]

or maybe from CB...lol

Wait...I know...thats including deer!!!

[1stdeadeye]

Way off track!

Originally posted by -=Squid=-
Ok, before I tell you how I feel about guns, I will first say this. DO NOT insult me because I am only 16.

No problem Junior!

DO NOT insult each other, for it only makes you look more unintelligent...anybody can name call, but not everybody can argue a legitamit point. Now, onward...

We save the insults for CB! BTW, there are rednecks in every state DB!

What is the point to guns? Really, why are they needed? Now, I am not talking about hunting rifles, although I do think there should be tighter restrictions, I am talking about handguns and other semiautomatic weapons. So, why do we need them? The only use they have is to kill people. Now, please, if you have an argument against this on what basis they have, please inform me. Did you know that more people in america were killed by handguns (33000 people) in ONE year, by other americans, than in the vietnam war, (30000) which lasted THREE years? Another fact, In one year, there wasnt one country that had more handgun deaths in one year that america. We beat every other researched country by 30000 people. You cant argue with statistics, and I know there is no person here who can argue a valid point on owning a handgun or other semiautomatic weapon.

First off, did you get your statistics from Michael Moore? Who taught you your history? That teacher should be smacked. Vietnam lasted over 10 years from the advisors to the final pullout. In Vietnam, we lost about 50,000 people. We have more auto fatqalities every year then that. Where did you get your handgun numbers? According to the FBI, in 2001, we had a total of 15,980 murders. Even if everyone of them was from a handgun, you are wrong. Also if 1/2 of them are hungun related, that would be generous. Suicides and justifiable use of firearms doesn't equal your quote. Get it right or be quiet!

As for why, as you are too young to legally possess a pistol, you may not understand. Target shooting and shooting for sport is fun. Go to a range some time and try it out.

BTW, Here are the crime facts, not the lies you quote: FBI CRIME REPORT FOR FULL YEAR 2001

So please bring facts, not a CB arguement!

[1stdeadeye]

Re: WV is so not cooler that AL

Originally posted by DaosBeoulve


Ahem....

We can buy gas at Walmart too.



I just didn't want those West Virginians to feel all special or anything, ya know?

Sorry man WV has everyone beat! That is a scary state. My wife's family owns a cabin and some hunting land in a little place called Old Town, Maryland. It is real close to PawPaw, WV. About 4 years ago while fishing at the cabin, we made a run into WV for fun. At a gas station accross the river from Cumberland, the convienence store sold: Gas, Groceries, Booze, Firearms, and Porn. That scared me. Imagine all those rednecks with porn and guns!

As for CB, rednecks are everywhere, even in Jersey. Be careful about calling names though, if you bring NH into it, Shartley might get mad!

[Rooster]

"Looks like someone doesn't like someone questioning American culture. I think the writer has a problem with MM, and tried to take minuet things and twist thing to try and downgrade a great film.

I loved the movie. It has a great message. Why is a gun so deeply imbedded in our culture. Why does a bank give out a gun as a reward for depositing money?

Why is it that we are so quick to protect this thing that is killing us at great numbers?

Why does the average citizen feel like they need to own a mini gun?

All of these are good questions that MM tried to answer in his Documentary."

Why do people feel the need to flap their fat gums to spew tripe? Oh yeah, becuase its their right, just as gun ownership is. You can take my freedom when you give up your freedom to flap your fat mouth about it.

[1stdeadeye]

THINK!

Originally posted by -Carnifex-
From what I heard it took MM all of 5-10 minutes to fill out the paper work for the gun.

THINK! This was a work of fiction. They don't give you a gun at the bank! This bank started doing this in conjunction with NRA marketing about 6 years ago. The article about it in American Banker was funny. The bank gives out gift certificates to redeem for the rifle at an affiliated firearms dealer. Come on you can't think a bank would hand out guns in it's lobby do you! MM was taking "artistic license" with the truth, you know making stuff up. It makes for better theatre!

You're out of bounds calling people Idiots. If you're trying to edbate something personal attacks is not the way to do it. Socrates comes to mind, can't quite remember the quote though: When the debate is lost the loser turns to slander.

Ah I love quotes. One of my favorites is that it is better to be silent and considered a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt.

Again I say to you think. This was his movie and it was not a documentary! BTW to get that rifle, MM just deposited around $25,000 of his own money for the next 10 years at a very, very low rate. That rifle is also considered taxable income on his 1099-INT. So if he really did go through with it, He put a bunch of money into a dead account for 10 years and will pay taxes this year on $2000 in interest in the form of the rifle for something he will never use!


I have a great counter too. Does anyone remember Carl Rowe (SP?)? He was a libereal columnist for the Washington Post about 15 years ago. He was an anti-gun crusader as well. Then a group of teens broke into his backyard to play in his pool. He shot one of them with an unregistered handgun. Got to love those hypocrits!

[DaosBeoulve]

Sorry man WV has everyone beat! That is a scary state. My wife's family owns a cabin and some hunting land in a little place called Old Town, Maryland. It is real close to PawPaw, WV. About 4 years ago while fishing at the cabin, we made a run into WV for fun. At a gas station accross the river from Cumberland, the convienence store sold: Gas, Groceries, Booze, Firearms, and Porn. That scared me. Imagine all those rednecks with porn and guns!

Ya know, for one second there, I was all warm and fuzzy inside, and actually thought AL might not be that bad.

Then, I realized that we can, in reality, one-up you.

Not only do we have stores that sell all of that, they also add in fishbait, old Chevy parts, and sometimes even used tires.

Yeah, once again, Alabama retains its title of worst state in the US. YAY

[-Carnifex-]

Re: THINK!

Originally posted by 1stdeadeye
Ah I love quotes. One of my favorites is that it is better to be silent and considered a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt.
[/B]

Once again, you prove to me that you have no idea how to debate.

"From what I heard" means that it may very well not be the truth. I didn't see the movie, therefore I said "From what I heard." So please, tell me how I made myself look foolish? Merely because I could not remember a quote?

[Collegeboy]

Why do you need a gun to make yourself feel safe at home?

[DaosBeoulve]

Why do you need a gun to make yourself feel safe at home?

There's a plethora of reasons.

For one, security systems can be bypassed. Even the best security systems.

People are stupid.

Drugs. They cost money.

[-J�ker-]

"Why is it that in the same store I can buy toilet paper, and food, I can also buy a gun and ammunition?"

"It's because you live in Alabama fool! You can probably get booze their too. The only state with more rednecks then you guys is West Virginia. In WV, you can get gas at that same store!"

you can buy food,toilet paper,cigs,alcohol,guns,kives,ammo,camo,clothes,tv s and even GAS at............WAAAAAAALLLLL-MAAAAARRRRRT

[Collegeboy]

Originally posted by DaosBeoulve


There's a plethora of reasons.

For one, security systems can be bypassed. Even the best security systems.

People are stupid.

Drugs. They cost money.

But why do you need a gun to feel protected. I mean here in the US people claim they need a gun to feel protected, while in other areas of the world, people don't feel so. Is it because the US has more crime, is more dangerous. No it isn't so why is the US people so afraid that they feel they need a gun to feel safe.

[Smegma]

Originally posted by Collegeboy
Why do you need a gun to make yourself feel safe at home?

Its very easy to say this when you never been in a situation in which you needed one. A couple of months ago there was a drive by shooting and my neighboor was almost killed; hidding under a matress while you her shots less than twenty feet away instills a very helpless feeling.

I feel its better to have one and not need it than it is to need one and not have it.

I am very touchy on this subject and decided to do a personal report on it just after the drive by. I found out that on average, something like 14% of yearly deaths were firearm related, but half of those deaths were self inflicted (not children, suicides), just thought that was interesting. Ill post some quotes i found from my research:


"The majority of peace officers I've talked to agree that gun laws only result in armed criminals preying on defenseless citizens. Instead of useless anti-gun owner legislation, what we need and need right now are tough anti-crime measures. Anti-gun bills only cloud the real issue. And those of us who actually battle crime pay the price."
Lt. Harry Thomas: Cincinnati Police Division,
American Rifleman, August 1989



"Since police started keeping statistics, we now know that assault weapons are/were used in an underwhelming 0.026 of 1% of crimes in New Jersey. This means that my officers are more likely to confront an escaped tiger from the local zoo than to confront an assault rifle in the hands of a drug-crazed killer on the streets."
Deputy Chief Joseph Constance:
Trenton, New Jersey Police Department,
speaking before a Senate Committee, 1993



"My personal opinion is mixed. We need to do something to make some sense out of what is happening on the streets, but as a practical matter, people who are illegally using firearms are not going to be stopped by licensing."
Major Aaron Campbell: Miami Metro Dade Police Department,
The Washington Times, December 10, 1993



"The anti-gun sentiment concerns me. It's another freedom someone is trying to take away. It's an artificial solution to the crime problem. In Memphis, very few semi-automatic firearms are confiscated from criminals. Let's leave law-abiding citizens alone. Criminals will continue to get guns illegally."
Ray Maples: Memphis Police ***'n President [American Rifleman, July 1989, pg.58]