UCLA student tasered by campus police for not showing ID

[pbzmag]

He wasn't. He was just a legitimate student in a computer lab who happened to forget his ID, and happened to have parents of Iranian descent. To assume that anyone meeting the above criteria is planning a school shooting is completely ridiculous. Those "idiots" are simply people looking for accountability, and I'm suprised they showed as much restraint as they did after witnessing that.

If the others did try to stop the officers, they could/would have been arrested for obstructions and assault and battery on a police officer.It would carry a max fine of $10k and up to three years in prison if there were any bodily injuries(PC 243). This is also classified as a felony "wobbler".

[Dubstar112]

So maybe there is a good debate here. The objective of police is to serve and protect citizens while upholding the law that relativley few percent of the citizens would have helped create. Well, it would be counter productive to commit "assault and battery " to the officers even if it could be proven that there was blatant police brutality. However the citizens in the room at the time for the most part back the "victim" for lack of a better term. There isnt any thing they could do to prevent an occurrance without being punished themselves.

If the student would have been beaten excessivley does any one feel that the people in the room should have tried to stop the police from beating him? Or does any one feel that if a police officer is out of line, that a civilian should try to correct that officer, or just let them be? Or is it the general consensus that police are "always right" because no one can stop them? Whos instructions were the officers following. Does school policy state that without ID you are not allowed in, or is it if asked for ID you must provide. So if you arent a student, but dont get checked you're in the clear... Maybe they should card students at the door... to prevent students from forgetting they need ID.

Anyone feel that insubordination on a low level like this poses a threat? Im not asking if he was right or wrong by not doing what told, but more was what he did a threat to the people in the room? School ID is mandatory I understand, so he should have known. He's to blame for the whole thing then. If he wouldnt have forgotten his ID he wouldnt be in this position. I feel that often the law overrides rational thoughts to some extent. Why couldnt they have just found a way to verify his identity. Its a learning center, he would have learned to bring his ID next time and to stop slacking while avoiding a bit of pain. Thats something maybe they should have considered.

They know they have the athourity, and they know when they use it, they become the most scrutinized form of public service. They are held accountable for every single thing they have control over, and somethings that they dont. So before they use their power, they need to consider the consequence aswell. Asking a student to leave has little consequence, dragging him out has a bit more consequence, and using force above that is begging for a frenzy. They have the power and the tools for the job. They just have to be very precise on how they do it.


Then again, what good is any kind of law enforcement when no matter what the enforcers do, they are criticized and scoped for thier actions. It usually becomes a complex matter.

Id like to remain indifferent, but for now the questions I come up with focus on the police a bit. Im sort of biased though, as I am a student myself. I can see that the older people on this forum support the police and the younger support the student. Thats a general statement.

[pbzmag]

They did not have the time to verify his identity. They were conducting an arrest in close quarters with other students around. Once they have control of the situation, then they can start their search for ID and any other contrabands. All arrests that I have seen on the streets and shows like COPS started with detainment and then the body search were conducted.

[Dubstar112]

Well, i did some editing before/while you posted that.

But I dont see how in that setting they could not have any sort of time for that. Do you need to have a person in handcuffs to verify thier identity? It was only his school identity that he was lacking correct? He must have had a state issued drivers or something similar? Innocent until proven guilty might lead one to think, take his name, look his info up is he enrolled? yes or no... then take it from there, opposed to, he doesnt have id, so hes not a student and cant use the facility, kick him out.

I must have overread that he was placed under arrest at the same time as being tasered and prior to being asked for any other form of ID. Im only assuming that they would have asked for another form after he is in custody.

[bornl33t]

Better word for "victim" = moron

why? Because the word victim implies he was Innocent. When he refused to leave he became guilty of criminal trespassing. Also he was given ample time between each blast from the teaser to raise his voice to cuss out the officers, complain and refuse to comply some more. This indicates that he was thoroughly capable of leaving himself.

Furthermore, you can see the officers trying to move him toward the exit. And after each teasering they make some progress.

Oh and if you watch the time at the bottom you will be able to tell the first time he is teasered it was 2 seconds.
the second time a minute later it was 4 seconds
and the third time it was 2 seconds almost 2 minutes later


So that rules out that he couldn't leave and if you watch this video for the rest of the story

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R4_s4Un0TkI&NR

you'll see that beam got it right, the police where called in because he refused to leave.

I see nothing so far that would indicate that this kid was either Innocent or acting rational. I stand by the police in this issue.

[Lohman446]

I love this. "All he did was forget his ID" Wrong. Once he could not prove he was supposed to be there and refused to leave the police had to consider it criminal trespass, unlawful entry, whatever you want to call it. That is acting on the knowledge they had at the time.

When he started his little temper tantrum he became a threat. Now the judgement call of the officers to how much of a threat is a judgement call based on any number of factors, but apparently the trained officers on scene considered it a pretty serious threat.

Tasers are not, correctly or not, taught to be used only as a less than lethal device only to be deployed in place of a firearm. They are used to counter active and passive resistance to an officer. It may be questionable but the officers on scene are probably taught that they tasers are a safe measure to use in such a situation. I would rather have an officer taser me (known risks) than decide to deploy his baton against me. That being said, there is no way I am letting a situation escalate to that level.

Could they have done better? Sure, and the situation would have been much much better had the other students stayed out of it (or just taped it quietly). I'm sorry, your dealing with a non-compliant individual you beleive a threat and are being threatened by a group of people. Judgement is obviously not perfect in such a situation.

The officers had a duty to remove him from the lab. They acted on that duty. Its not like they were walking down the street, cried "ARAB" and attacked. Despite the shock "journalism" that some students seem so fond of.

[pbzmag]

Well, i did some editing before/while you posted that.

But I dont see how in that setting they could not have any sort of time for that. Do you need to have a person in handcuffs to verify thier identity? It was only his school identity that he was lacking correct? He must have had a state issued drivers or something similar? Innocent until proven guilty might lead one to think, take his name, look his info up is he enrolled? yes or no... then take it from there, opposed to, he doesnt have id, so hes not a student and cant use the facility, kick him out.

I must have overread that he was placed under arrest at the same time as being tasered and prior to being asked for any other form of ID. Im only assuming that they would have asked for another form after he is in custody.

Again, they did not have time. Do you really think that he would have given his name or any other identification after his tantrum? He already demonstrated that he is unwilling to comply. It is already beyond if he is enrolled. It is now tresspassing and that is arrestable. Getting any ID becomes their secondary goal. But what about the other officers? They're the backup. They are there to help if the situation gets out of control. Detaining the person is their main objective.

[Steelrat]

I love this. "All he did was forget his ID" Wrong. Once he could not prove he was supposed to be there and refused to leave the police had to consider it criminal trespass, unlawful entry, whatever you want to call it. That is acting on the knowledge they had at the time.

When he started his little temper tantrum he became a threat. Now the judgement call of the officers to how much of a threat is a judgement call based on any number of factors, but apparently the trained officers on scene considered it a pretty serious threat.

Tasers are not, correctly or not, taught to be used only as a less than lethal device. They are used to counter active and passive resistance to an officer. It may be questionable but the officers on scene are probably taught that they tasers are a safe measure to use in such a situation. I would rather have an officer taser me (known risks) than decide to deploy his baton against me. That being said, there is no way I am letting a situation escalate to that level.

Could they have done better? Sure, and the situation would have been much much better had the other students stayed out of it (or just taped it quietly). I'm sorry, your dealing with a non-compliant individual you beleive a threat and are being threatened by a group of people. Judgement is obviously not perfect in such a situation.

The officers had a duty to remove him from the lab. They acted on that duty. Its not like they were walking down the street, cried "ARAB" and attacked. Despite the shock "journalism" that some students seem so fond of.

Yep, the student escalated the situation past where it was. The officers were not trying to arrest him, just escort him out of the building.

Tasers are correctly considered non-lethal weapons. A lot of the fatalaties that people try to pin on them were, in fact, the direct result of drugs the people were on, or pre-existing medical conditions that were affected by a tense/stressful situation. I love how people expect the officers to "duke it out" with a suspect, even though officers are routinely injured in physical struggles with suspects. Tasers are probably the least dangerous of the devices that can be used, with batons and OC being the other choices. Batons are especially bad because a missed strike, due to bad aim or target movement, can result in a shattered knee.

The best irony is, of course, that people love to complain about the police, but who are the first people they call when they need help?

[Glickman]

The best irony is, of course, that people love to complain about the police, but who are the first people they call when they need help?

byaaah!

[Ole Unka Phil]

The best irony is, of course, that people love to complain about the police, but who are the first people they call when they need help?

First person I call is Gaston Glock... then I let the police do the paperwork... and tote off the body.

[tropical_fishy]

The best irony is, of course, that people love to complain about the police, but who are the first people they call when they need help?

Ghostbusters!

[kosmo]

does any one feel that if a police officer is out of line, that a civilian should try to correct that officer, or just let them be? Or is it the general consensus that police are "always right" because no one can stop them?

Not that this incident fits the bill, but the second ammendment constitutionally guarantees your right to shoot bad cops. I havent tested that theory in court yet, but it says it plain as day.

[olinar]

i dont think its a big deal.i mean sure they could have just taised him once but oh well who wouldnt get trigger happy.the kids name just had to be mostafa didnt it.i bet hes going to turn this into a racistr thing if it gets to court.then i will lmao while rofl and then get up and lol.possibly crap myself a little later after thinking about it again.

[olinar]

if i were one of those cpos i would just kicked him in the head a couple times.i would love to be a police officer.but anyway i would beat the crap out him after the first taser.

[kosmo]

if i were one of those cpos i would just kicked him in the head a couple times.i would love to be a police officer.but anyway i would beat the crap out him after the first taser.

In that case, he definitely wouldve been constitutionally right in shooting you.