Deadlywind hAir trigger demo video

[nicad]

hope I can answer a few questions--

-The hAir trigger has been, to date, completely Deadlywind's work.

-AGD is interested. We (Deadlywind) would be fools not to work with them in getting this out as an available product for mags.

-Tom's posts have been so far strictly "what if" scenarios so that he/AGD can maybe answer some questions/concerns they may have about considering going forward with us about it.

-yes protection can take a long time. To me, on this product, proper protection holds a high priority. It is too important to have someone or some other company just take it away.

-As it has been mentioned already, this gripframe uses pneumatics. This does NOT make it an autococker. I only used one part which an autococker uses, but that same part is also use on 99% of all electros as well. EVERY paintball marker utilizes pneumatics at some level.

-There are no timing issues.

-This prototype does not use the ULT kit. I have not yet tested it with the ULT-- there is possibility the trigger pull could go down even lighter. But as someone said: "2oz is already in the stupid range".

-It will probably be an entire triggerframe to bolt on. At one time I had hoped to make it as a drop in mod to existing triggerframes, but that is pretty much impossible.

-many many many questions about price. It would be smart to keep it AT or BELOW the price of electro upgrades. Is that possible? I don't know. I would be very happy it could be done though.

hope this helps some...

out!

[fire1811]

thanks for the update
can i get mine tomorrow???

[Cryer]

Originally posted by nicad
...-There are no timing issues...

That was my main concern...

[Python14]

So for most intents and purposes this can be done to intelliframes(as demonstated), Y-frames, Z-frames, Logic Vert frames, etc?

Does it have any major effect on efficiency?

[Cryer]

Oh, Colin-

Question:

Can users adjust pull length/weight? Easily?

Just curious, as I like my pull a little longer than most.

Python-

-It will probably be an entire triggerframe to bolt on. At one time I had hoped to make it as a drop in mod to existing triggerframes, but that is pretty much impossible

[QUINCYMASSGUY]

Hopefully I'm not throwing water on Nicad's fire with this, but if Punisher Customs produced a very similar product a while back, would that be considered prior art and completely prevent Nicad for patenting the idea so basically if it gets popular, any company could produce it with just minor mods to keep some originality? I have no intention of doing it myself, and most AGD fans would prefer to go with an AGD-approved item, but it seems a concern that could exist if someone like SP decided to produce a low-quality but lower price replica to push you out of business with it. Since alot of people are cringing at the price (though the price is justified) that could be potentially damaging. Hopefully you have a gameplan in mind to prevent all that.

[Jack & Coke]

Timing issues are mostly for two-stage triggers (e.g. cockers) right? This mod looks like the only thing the trigger is used for is to actuate the special 3-way Nicad made.

[Gadget]

Originally posted by QUINCYMASSGUY
Hopefully I'm not throwing water on Nicad's fire with this, but if Punisher Customs produced a very similar product a while back, would that be considered prior art and completely prevent Nicad for patenting the idea

I wouldn't have thought so. I'm guessing that what nicad is patenting isn't the concept of using pneumatics to trip the sear (which has been done by a few people before), but rather the custom pneumatics that he's designed which allow the ridiculously light 'walkable' trigger. It looks revolutionary to me.

nicad - If you've already applied for a patent, doesn't that mean you're protected already....even if it hasn't been granted yet?

Glad to hear that this doesn't use the ULT. ULT is a great bit of inventiveness, but is yet another thing (alongside L10) which needs to be tuned - I like the idea of keeping things simple.

[sitting_duck]

if Nicad and TK agree to produce this as a joint effort, is this something that will eventually be added to the RT Custom? for example could one choose this option insted of the intelliframe and the ULT kit? or will it be sold as an add-on only, much like a race frame for cockers (with the exception of the Race HB)?

[ScatterPlot]

All you guys with the cost discussion- what you say may be true for someone doing business from their home, who buys all the parts just like everyone else does. However, if AGD made this, how much do you think it would cost? Production wise, I'd say you could be safe with 70 for the intelliframe, and I'd guess that's higher that what it really is (I'm including labor in this). 3-ways are WAY less than $30 if you don't get the "Paintball-approved" kind. I'd guess $10 max. Same with the ram, say $15. The regulator is probably the most expensive part, at probably a max of like $30. It doesn't have to be super-consistent, since all it does is move a ram, and not have S2S consistency. All that is like what, $155? To build one of these, by itself? Buying in bulk would drop it even lower than that. I would probably guess a $200 maximum or so, frame and everything like that included. I would also guess that if you had your existing frame retrofitted, if theyre even going to do that, to knock off something like $60 or so. Now don't get me wrong here, I REALLY want one of these triggers and would probably end up paying $300 for one if that's what it ended up being, but I don't think it will be that much. Just trying to give some hope to the community :)

[baka]

Originally posted by Nicad: many many many questions about price. It would be smart to keep it AT or BELOW the price of electro upgrades. Is that possible? I don't know. I would be very happy it could be done though.

hope this helps some... out![/B]

hope is what i'm hanging on. I also hope that this mod could be retro fitted to a 90* frame even though you say it is immpossible now.

[Dryden]

That's very cool, but somehow, I think the only time I'll ever get to see one of those is when I'm laying in the fetal position at the other end of that thing.

[trains are bad]

I hope it's doable in a ygrip or else it's useless to me. The ygrip is 3/4 of the reason I have a mag at all.

[yaddatrance]

Originally posted by bertmcmahan
All you guys with the cost discussion- what you say may
be true for someone doing business from their home, who
buys all the parts just like everyone else does. However,
if AGD made this [...] Just trying to give some hope to the
community :)

I have to say, from my experience with manufacturing
system boards, if AGD doesn't choose to roll this out
across all their markers, for all intensive purposes,
they would get the same price for components as a small
shop. They'd have to buy at least 100,000 units before
true economies of scale apply. 10,000 units is where most
companies just start to talk to you. Plus you're just
talking parts AFTER they engineered it, plus they
need to keep a rainy day fund in case they all need to
be recalled/fixed, etc...

Don't be surprised if it's more than $300 and AGD
decides to use it as the base of their next big mag.

[hardr0ck68]

So if we make this and there is a huge waiting list are you going to be upset? [/QUOTE]

Yes, honestly nothing is more annoying then spending money and having to wait months to have something to show for it....

Are you going to tell me "If you don't get it out now, no one is going to buy it"?[/QUOTE]

No, but DO NOT release anything offical until you are ready to sell the first run, let other people "leak" stuff from time to time, to keep intrest. The first time i hear anything offical about this should be after an AM-Open or Mardi Gras Open i should read on warpig that AGD's long roumored frame is out.

If the first batch has issues, are you going to ask me what's taking so long? [/QUOTE]

Give the first 10 assembled to your tourny teams, and have them beat the crap outta it...if it works well for them with a handful os sand in it its ready for release!

How many of you are willing to overpay to get it right away and then we charge you to upgrade it with fixes later? [/QUOTE]

it worked for SP on every gun they ever released! WDP has done it a time or two... just dont admit the issue, fix it on the "second generation" and sell an "upgrade" for the first one that "increases efficentacy" or "increases consistancy" or "reduceses trigger stick" or whatever odd peoblem the "first generation" developes.

Will you compare it to your 'fill in the blank' electro and tell us your battery powered gizmo is still better?[/QUOTE]

Yeah....some people will say that. I personally will be happy. ESPACALLY if you release slightly different modles each year and an upgrade kit that say, drops the pull to 1oz. Why? Cause i want more gizmos on my marker than the guy next to me in the chron station!

When cheater boards are made legal the same way all the other cheats in paintball have evolved, will you dump this? [/QUOTE]

Maybe, but if a all mechanical league evolves this WILL be the only gun to use...all other teams shootin cockers or what have you wont be doing so because there gun is faster, but cause they are paid to...you will own that league. If cheater guns are made legal and AGD hopes to compete in that league they will need to make a cheater gun...thats just the long and short of that.