For everyone that says that 15BPS limit is slowing them down

[REDRT]

You know AGD is going to fold if they don't come up with something faster. The majority of the paintball players don't give a crap on 15BPS. Faster is better in most peoples minds. I try and try to get people interested in the Emag or just mags in general. With little to no luck. Because mainly they are slower than whats under the spot light of today. 15BPS isn't in the cards! If something like the hAir trigger did come out and it shoot more than 15bps you all would chear. Since AGD electros are gone you dis ultra fast electro-markers. We are stuck in a rut here. Some people here are demanding the rest of the industry to back off! Why, just so we might feel better about are slower markers? Not going to happen. I myself just might mod the Emag so it shoots ropes like no other. Tom built it well. It will do it! Because I want to use more paint or quote, "cheat". DUH! By the way, "if close to everyone has one, how can it be cheating"? Seriously my motives are to just to get AGD back into the minds of the people that really matter, "The Not Yet Mag Users". Someone has to do it! If not AGD's dead beat ad dept staff then us.

[tyrion2323]

What the heck are you talking about?

This isn't the "old, trite rant" thread. This is a thread about regulating tournament format.

[XSSPL]

15 BPS is a welcome thought for me. Being that me and my mag are just happy with 5-6 BPS.

DITTO! my classic single trigger is slow as poop log on a cold day, but I still love it!


I'm an old schooler, which may lead you to believe that I have some kind of resentment towards the speed demon markers of today... quite the opposite actually.

Think about the origins of paintball - War Games - men running around in the woods trying to shoot one another. Now if you equate the game to a war simulation - what comes to mind?

A typical military type squad - machine gunners, snipers, scouts, rear echelon... etc

the fast guns have a place in paintball - you have to adapt your game to deal with the ever changing environment of war!! I shoot a slow azz classic mag and weekend after weekend I get a lions share of respect out of the local "touney level team players" all shooting the fastest markers money can buy.

Would I love to have one? YES Can I justify dropping what is basically a down payment on a new car for a paintball gun? HELL NO So what's my alternative? Quit... no freakin way

[SlartyBartFast]

You know AGD is going to fold if they don't come up with something faster.

That's a load of crap.

Guess Tippmann, Kingman, JT, Viewloader, and Brass Eagle are going to fold because their guns are so slow. And they're such cheap plastic.

If scenario and backwoods/renegade games are 90% of the market, a 5% market share will beat a 50% share of the tournament/speedball scene. In fact it would be better. Far more margin and profit in mass-produced high volume standard products than there is in limited high-end custom products.

[tyrion2323]

That's a load of crap.

Guess Tippmann, Kingman, JT, Viewloader, and Brass Eagle are going to fold because their guns are so slow. And they're such cheap plastic.

If scenario and backwoods/renegade games are 90% of the market, a 5% market share will beat a 50% share of the tournament/speedball scene. In fact it would be better. Far more margin and profit in mass-produced high volume standard products than there is in limited high-end custom products.

Uhm, I don't know what calculator you're using, but....

Out of a possible 100%:

50% of 10% = 5% of the whole
5% of 90% = 4.5% of the whole


Here's the problem with your argument. You make a direct comparison between AGD and Kingman. The thing is, Kingman SELLS A LOT OF GUNS. AGD barely sells any. Not only that, but a Kingman Mech costs $79, while an AGD mech costs $400. A Kingman Electro costs $150, while an AGD electro costs $899. Kingman markets like crazy. AGD doesn't market. It's a pattern.

There are two MAIN brackets, into one of which a successful paintball marker falls:
CHEAP & LOW END and EXPENSIVE & HIGH END

None of AGD's guns fall into either category. With outdated technology and no marketing, AGD will likely fold, unless they do something special. So I agree with you - it's not speed that will break AGD. It's everything else.

[RRfireblade]

So I agree with you - it's not speed that will break AGD. It's everything else.

Amazing when you really think about it. The AGD valve system has always been and until very recently, the single fastest system in the history of the game.....and it's current 'Rep' is for being slow.

Marketing....Mmmm...good.

[Lohman446]

There are two MAIN brackets, into one of which a successful paintball marker falls:
CHEAP & LOW END and EXPENSIVE & HIGH END

None of AGD's guns fall into either category. With outdated technology and no marketing, AGD will likely fold, unless they do something special. So I agree with you - it's not speed that will break AGD. It's everything else.

I have argued for sometime now that if AGD made a high end, flashy marker.. and priced it well beyond the top end - I'm talking close to 2K... they may stand a cahcne of creating a prestige marker. Im thinking the DevilMag style, perhaps with more custom bodies available but still....

Thread for discussion http://www.automags.org/forums/showt...prestige+brand

[LudavicoSoldier]

If we had an across the board 15bps cap, we might see more midrange markers being marketed by the industry. Think about it, most, if not all of the guns that were popular both in the rec AND tourny scene over the last 5 or so years have died out. For example, companies whose mainstay was custom cockers have DROPPED the cocker all together (SP, Shocktech). New players are being given very few options when they go to buy their second gun, in terms of bang for bucks.

For example: Boston Paintball used to stock an EXCELLENT selection of guns (ICD, CCI, AGD, WGP, SP, etc). Now they stock low end guns, and jump directly to the shocker/timmy/matrix range. If so much emphasis was not put of speed, we would see alot more variety in the marketplace. I don't know about you, but I think that that would be a GOOD thing.

[SlartyBartFast]

For example, companies whose mainstay was custom cockers have DROPPED the cocker all together (SP, Shocktech). New players are being given very few options when they go to buy their second gun, in terms of bang for bucks.

:rofl: :rofl:

It's simple, paintball players are STUPID and VAIN.

The reason there are no more "custom cockers" now is that all the vain hype-monkeys who need the latest and flashiest and have no control over their spending have moved on to other markers. The majority people who like the cocker have realised that they all perform the same and twice the price for little more than flash is a waste of money.

Bang for buck? For a second marker? Any stock marker will do.

Custom is virtually nothing better than stock except for colours and milling.

A perfect second gun for most players with multi-thousand dollar guns is a simple no-brainer choice. The exact same gun with no milling and in a single standard colour. 600 dollars cheaper at least.

[tyrion2323]

:rofl: :rofl:

It's simple, paintball players are STUPID and VAIN.

The reason there are no more "custom cockers" now is that all the vain hype-monkeys who need the latest and flashiest and have no control over their spending have moved on to other markers. The majority people who like the cocker have realised that they all perform the same and twice the price for little more than flash is a waste of money.

Bang for buck? For a second marker? Any stock marker will do.

Custom is virtually nothing better than stock except for colours and milling.

A perfect second gun for most players with multi-thousand dollar guns is a simple no-brainer choice. The exact same gun with no milling and in a single standard colour. 600 dollars cheaper at least.

A lot of secondary guns do include new valves, bolts, etc...

But I agree with you that $600 extra for a custom gun is kinda ridiculous. (unless you're rich, because then it really wouldn't matter!)