10 years of Paintball...and its going down hill

[wetwrks]

Greed is a factor, but it's the companies and the dealers who are causing us to resort to buying paint wholesale. I checked a price-list of a friends, he gets Hellfire for 38 a case... And sells it for 75... (I paid 65 at the event). Smart-Parts Ions are roughly 120 wholesale (According to a SP dealer I've talked with and am good friends with). Eclipse Ego's are around 800 wholesale and retail for 1200. (Again according to a dealer I spoke with). These companies and dealers are making a lot of money off of us because we let them.

I also find it interesting that you say your store doesn't stock new parts, when they run out of old parts they can't buy old parts, they have to buy new and updated parts. I've never heard of a store reselling used parts. Sounds more like an isolated incident.

Glorify guns that people can't afford? If people can't afford to spend $500.00 on a marker, they shouldn't be playing paintball, a players first time playing paintball is around 40-50$ depending on where they play and what they offer. If they can't see it's an expensive sport from that, I don't know what will show them.

Sorry, but you are incorrect on your thinking. Even with the markup that you mention, I still hear stores complaining that they "arn't making anything" on the gun, the paint, the...

I know of several stores here in Denver who have sold used parts to players and claimed that they were new. And I have seen the parts, if that is new from the factory, then i would hate to see used as those parts wouldn't even work.

"If people can't afford to spend $500.00 on a marker, they shouldn't be playing paintball" what an elitist attitude. Most kids (kids - the ones who will make or break the future of the sport) don't have $500.00 to spend on a "toy". And expecially when they also need a tank, mask, squeegie, cammies, remote hose, powered hopper, better barrel, barrel plug, not to forget ammo and fills... My parents wouldn't have gone for it.

You (and the industry) need to remember that without new players, the sport will whither and die. And you don't get and keep new players by pricing everything "decent" out of their reach. Nor by unloading on a newby, squid, or whatever they call em' now at 22 or 30 or even 15 balls per second.

[nathanjones008]

interesting.

I didnt fet the chance to read all of this thread(sorry) I have played mostly rec ball. some speedball! In my times of playing, i see nothing wrong with electros. Its is by far mostly skills and tactics rather the assumption that its the e- guns that mess everything up. In my group(14-20 give or take, we have new peeps play on a regular basis) peeps that play, we have about 50% electro, spyders, pmrs, cockers. The rest are mech guns.

I used to play with my mag as my main gun(many years ago) I tagged peeps out with angels, timmys as much as they tagged me out. when i started playing with peeps with electros, it gave me a greater drive to improve my skills, and stand up tp them and face them head on!! I didnt let electro mess up my day,( i gave them a run for their money.)

Now i have a pmr. LAst week when i played we have 7 v 7 capture the flag.(woodsball of course) On my team i was the only with an electro, the rest where spyders and tippmans and so forth. The other team and two mags, two pm6s, two elctric spyder. SO it appears we are out gunned. Before the game started we made a great plan. Every player had his duty.through this we overthrew the team that had the advantage with the electros. According to many we should have lost, This is one one of the donzens of example of how skills always comes out on top in the worls of paintball. Heck i played speedball with a pump a few times and pop some peeps.

So bring on your angels, pmrs, timmy, cockers, Thanks to these really great guns and great operators, have made me go out of my comfort zone and grow some ballz

[C.J.]

I played in 1993. LineSI Bushmaster, PGP, Splatmaster, a Pneumatic Design "Storm" and I saw 'mags and 'cockers on field. I realize this thread started before I got back into paintball in 2006 but I had to comment.

The original poster had it right.

Lighting up a walk-on with an electro is not good for the sport. I did it ONCE and probably felt worse than the poor people I lit up. I play with a mech semi-auto now, a Classic Automag.

You don't need to rip a rope to take out the electro guys. I take great pleasure it firing one shot off the break and taking out a guy who's shooting back with something like a Shocker or Ego. I don't move nearly as much though if I'm up against a 15+bps electro versus a full mech or pump game.

I agree wtih Nathanjones that playing against people who use superior (read: "electro-pneumatic") gear is a challenge and a great way to improve skill.

One of the fellows at my field has been using a heavily upped SP Nerve. He replaced it with a Mini. This guy is the prototypical "problem baller." He doesn't wipe, he doesn't play on, he doesn't cheat. He's married to his gear's capabilities. He will NOT tone it down when there are new kids or walk-ons playing.

I shoot a far less "capable" marker - the Automag - but when there are less skilled players around, most of the time, I'll shoot the bunker next to them as a lesson they could have been taken out.

When I was just starting, I wish people would have treated me the same way but instead, I got lit up.

One of the forum members used to use a sig that went something like:

"If the people you're playing against don't look forward to the next chance they get to play, you've failed in your duty as a paintballer."

That attitude seems to be lost in today's world, not just on the paintball field but in life in general.

[nathanjones008]

i agree too

thank you! i think the electro peeps should be mixed in with the mechs in all games to even things out more.

[caylegeorge]

I just want to point out that you dont need to spend a lot to comete in paintball today. Sure you CAN buy a $500+ marker etc, but you dont have to.

There are plenty of affordable competitive options, for example the ion ($185), or even less expensive e markers, or mechs that preform well.

As many of us know, the gun doesn't make the player.

In my opinion nothing has really changed over the last decade+. When I bought my first semi auto marker in 1994, at 14 years old, I saved up for months doing odd jobs and scraping cash together. I saved up $500 and bought a micromag (high end gun at the time). I could have spent much less on an equally capable marker, but I wanted the extra quality and status that came with that. I also could have spent a lot more at the time for a marker, but I would have been paying for looks, or percieved preformance boost which really wouldnt have mattered much.

I feel kids can afford the sport if they are commited to it, and it is only the want of high priced equipment versus capable lower priced equipment that makes it seem overly expensive.

In the mid 90's guns ranged in price from about $40 to $1500+ with the higher end starting at about $400. Now days I see the same price range, but it seems "high end" markers are starting at a bit lower price range.

Paint is cheaper now, air is cheaper, prices seem down to me.

What I do think has happened is that morality and honor in the sport have declined. Businesses will always push to make people think they need the latest equipment to be competitive, that has always been a part of paintball.

What needs to happen is paintball needs to swing back toward honor and integrity on the field.

-cAyle

[Thotograph]

I was just thinking about what kind of play I like and why... basically I don't like speedball b/c to me it seems monotonous to me. I guess I like the variety of woods and rec play. I've watched alot of speedball and even photographed at an nppl event. I respect their game and the challenges it holds but it's not for me personally as a player. I'm 22 but I started playing a little over a decade ago. I did take an extended break from the sport during high school, sold my mag & mech cocker to help pay for a Marshall 100watt

Nowadays I use an electric marker (03 Viking), but I use it on semi only. Well that along with the mags, just got the Viking so I'm enjoying it. I think my oldschool roots have carried over just fine into todays era, and I'm having just as much fun now as I ever have. Last Sunday I played the entire day on 1k rounds that I had left over from the prior weekend, and shot so many people out it was a little scary. At the end of my day I tipped the rest of what was in my hopper to some kid who was out of paint but still wanted to play more.

Sure the kid spraying paint in the back can be a nuesance... all you gotta do is shoot him and then he goes away... that's why I love this sport. As for shady businesses and companies of the like... I'm not going to confirm or deny that they exist, its just that they just don't exist to me because I won't bring them my business. I'm just glad mags have stood up to time thus far. AGD for life.

[soren]

I'm definatly a woodsballer. I'm not very interested in speedball at all. However, I have played my games of speedball. My main problem with the sport is two fold really; the first being that both sides of the sport dog on the other. Woods players hate speed player, speed players hate woods players (I know this is an over simplification). The other being that a lot of ppl who use electros don't know how to hold their trigger. They are too busy trying to "get their gun off" that they never realize or just don't care that they tagged their target(s) within the first three balls, and that the extra 5-10 "Bonus balls" were not only unneccissary but also a waste.

Now by all means, own your electros, use them to play, use them to gain full enjoyment of the sport (I own and Ion myself, as a back up to my Minimag). But please, please check your trigger finger; as everyone knows it only takes one ball. If you can't do it in three, you should cut your losses and move on.

And this goes for all players, not just speedball players; but those from the woods, sim games and rec ball.

[Thotograph]

No offense but it'd probably be easier to overshoot someone with my RT... I hardly ever shoot someone more than once or twice anyways... I don't think the type of marker has much to do with the outcome of your game, and being observant has nothing to do with the operation of your gun. Ramping is where you get a lot of the overshooting. I avoid that crap. I agree with you that the ragging on between woods and speed sucks but I don't experience much of that here in Orlando. I agree with the previous notions that honor and integrity should be placed in higher regard.

Lol one of the fields I play at is literally divided, there's a hyper section and a woods section split long ways. Sometimes we play the whole field (hyper + woods), often we only use the hyper field, and occasionally a woods only game occurs. During the games where its the entire field I often walk down the part right on the border of the woods and field, staying covered in the wooded area... It's kinda strange, sometimes you'll get a concentration of speed kids shooting at the some woodsballers... and guess who has the advantage of camouflage It's my favorite strategy for that scenario but you can't use it all the time.

[bryceeden]

I agree with the thread starter to a point, but with the Spyder VS series out and kind of the Ion, the average player can afford a marker that can compeat. I used a Spyder VS 2 with a tadao board at a tourney about a month ago total marker cost well below $300. I can honestly say that this marker can compeat with anything out there. I use a gen 4 Timmy and while its way lighter and doesn't have the recoil of the Spyder the spyder can shoot just as fast and accuratly. Plus while there is always the dumb kid who will hose as much and as fast as he can constantly, most good players only shoot high speed when laning or shooting at a moving target. I am one of the players who took afew years off and came back and it took awhile to realise the game is the same, people shoot faster, but the movement is still what wins the games.

[Thotograph]

Well put man, that's the only time I really tap into the speed of any of my markers.

[mag_lover05]

speaking of over shooting..at my field, 3-5 hits is standard, they dont even call over shooting, so i just tell people, however many times you hit me, ill hit you double next time your walkin off. i quickly find several to adopt that and pretty soon, were only gettin hit 1-2 times