10 years of Paintball...and its going down hill

[LONEWOLFOO1]

If you take a super gun of today, and a mech from yesterday - it's WAY easier to shoot a new gun at 7 bps than an older mech at 7. The ease at which you can fire a marker I think is important to note. A cocker/mag/etc. from before... took considerable effort (in comparison) to shoot fast. I used to fumble with the trigger, short-stroke... etc. and miss people because of it. And you can't just hold it any which way because you lose leverage on the trigger. The electro made it effortless. You also can't shoot fast for very long without getting tired, not so with a new marker.

You can put paint where you want it, when you want to - easily. You can hold it however you want, shoot really fast as long as you want without fatigue. Instead of fighting with your marker, you can concentrate completely on the game. Somebody had fast fingers with a mech? They no longer have any advantage. EVERYBODY can shoot fast. Everybody is 7'4" on the court.

IMO there is a drastic advantage that an electro has over a mech. And 20bps is not just for show. It's way easier to hit people. Say you have a 0.3 second window of opportunity to hit someone. I'd rather have 6 balls in the air, than 3-4. And you multiply this with how many times you get those opportunities. Better odds.

in other words yes they will be makeing guns that will shoot 50bps

[JimmyBeam]

question #1-why is this thread stickied?
question #2-why argue/discuss/state opinions on something that has been beat to death, dug up, hit with a shovel, and then bonus balled?
eveyone here has an opinion, and guess what.......not one opinion will make everyone happy. there i go, i solved this thread. you can stop wearing out your keyboard and going back to doing something else that is just as uselss.
if you dont like woodsball dont play there, if you dont like e-markers dont buy or play with them, if you dont like dont do it!! it not like someone is forcing you to shoot pump, or making you play in the woods, or telling you that you have to play a certain way. dont worry about what you dont like, be happy and play what you do like.

#1 Becasue Tom said so.......
#2 Becasue this is what you do on forums, argue your point to someone who could care less about what you think, becasue they are god in their own little e-world.

[soren2004]

Jimmybeam, being god in his little world, thinks he can belittle everyone around him with his views on discussions...

Since he has no opinions, on anything, no one else can either...

[MedicDVG]

dang.. I could have sworn I had an opinion... oh well, sucks to be me...

[RusskiX]

Jimmybeam, being god in his little world, thinks he can belittle everyone around him with his views on discussions...

Since he has no opinions, on anything, no one else can either...

Soren,

your original post had some merit in promoting discussion and was supported by several other AO members, myself included. BUT now you're just getting belligerent and flaming anything that moves. Your join date is showing...

Maybe its time for mods to unsticky/close this thread as its not doing anything constructive now.

[soren2004]

Well, this isnt my first webboard and Ive seen this all happen before. Its perfectly ok to jab at the new guy (the guy not on the payroll), but if he jabs back, its time to close it all down.

[madmatt151]

Well, I was just wondering where you live Soren? See I am in the NYC area and these prices you quote are pretty average for us. We get used to it and expect it. I know in other parts of the country they are allowed to take paint on the field and buiy it cheap at the field, but that isn't true everywhere. Now if you live in an area that things are expensive, like NYC, then you must accept this fact. Also, you are comparing playing paintball to going to a movie. Playing piantball is an outside athletic activity. You really can't compare the two activities. Now to compare playing paintball to another sport that combines athleticism, thinking, role play, technology and overall feel of paintball, well I htink you might have a short list there. Fun isn't always the same for all people. Yes it is an expensive sport. I have a bunch of fields whcih are "local" a 45 min to 1 hour drive and they range is being very good at seperating beginnners from experienced to some which are kill fests. My advice, stay away frm the ones that aren't good. If you don't have one, then start one. I was seriously interested in starting a field here in NYC and did a lot of research. Then one was started by the guys from a local store and its great. There was a need and it got filled. If there is such a need in your area for beginner paintball fields and it seems that there is no other places to go, then start one. Or try to get someone to start one. Paintball is a business and it is meant to make money, and it seems that you have shown a need ofr beginner paintball. If you did start 10 years ago, I started over 15, then you have some knowledge, age and maturity to make these decisions. Try to start a field. First, tell where you live. I read a lot the replies to yor post, but not all, you might have said this already. I didn't see it. If the local fields are going out of business around you, you might be right i that they have bad business practices. Change em. Make a better mousetrap. Just my $.02

[soren2004]

Sorry, this is a little off topic.

Madmatt151, you brought up how expensive everything is in New York. I have a few co-workers who are from New York. What they were saying is that while they get paid about 1/2 of what they would have been paid in New York, the cost of living is easily 1/4 of that in the city. And they say that their quality of life is much better since they moved out of the city .

They also say that if they lived in the city they would never own a piece of property and would constantly be living "pay check to pay check" because of the expense of everything in that market.

What i just dont understand is if its so expensive there, why isnt there a mass exodus of people? Its already happening in California and Im just shocked with how bad many of my co-workers describe New York that people stick around.

What keeps you in the city if the market is so corrupt and artificially expensive? Why not move further west and into cities where you could actually own a home and car, on a single income, and without going into heavy debt?

Again, sorry for being so off topic, but I am curious.

[hitech]

Its already happening in California...

Apparently not. Housing prices continue to soar. If the demand weren't so high the prices would at least level off...

[JimmyBeam]

Jimmybeam, being god in his little world, thinks he can belittle everyone around him with his views on discussions...

Since he has no opinions, on anything, no one else can either...

glad to see your seeing it my way

[hitech]

Some indicators would disagree...

http://patrick.net/housing/crash.html

Let me preface my comments with my personal belief that the housing market in CA is going to see the bottom fall out. I've been expecting it to happen for years. It hasn't, yet.

Now, I don't know where they are getting their "facts" from, but the volume of Official Records transactions has not dropped in Santa Clara County. I have first hand knowledge of this as the County Recorder uses our software to record deeds and other Official records. House sales make up a huge part of that volume. That puts ALL their "facts" into question.

My parents just sold my Grandmothers house in San Jose. They got $650,000 for it. It's a since enough house, but nothing extraordinary. The house across the street from me just sold for at least $500,000. The held two open houses, accepted offers only until a week after the second open house and put up a sold sign a week later. A friend of mine is putting his mothers house on the market for $380,000. Less than six months ago they were going to list it for $330,000. That is not a market that is even cooling, much less crashing.

I still believe that the market HAS to "crash". But I've thought that for a while now, and it just isn't happening.

[MicroMiniMe]

I still believe that the market HAS to "crash". But I've thought that for a while now, and it just isn't happening.

Is that going to be when 1/2 of CA slides into the ocean?

Man, $360,000 for modest houses, is it just houses or all real estate. At that rate $10/day strip lot parking must be a steal.

[shades]

tatooed

For all of you gentleman who can shoot above 10bps should have your rof tatooed on your trigger finger because for that is an impressive talent or an impressive bounce, ramp or cheater board. Cheating, Shortcuts, hacks are the diesease of generantion x and y it started sometime when losing is not an option and winnnig is tied with your self worth. There was a time winning a game took alittle talent and skill and time no matter what you were doing or playing. Even video games now come with cheat modes built in. Computer games get hacked and installed cheats installed for an unfair advantage. I know dont whine, get out or get another gun so we can see who is the better CHEATER. I have an EMag. i am more than talented enough to setup a killer cheat. But i wont because you LEARN by mistakes. Losing builds character. Cheating teaches nothing and degrades your character, for the more you cheat the easier it is. ex:Jeremy Salm Cheating is equal to lying and liars cant play paintball for it is a game of HONOR. for example I have watched Xball and beeen in awe with the talent and honor in which the the game is played. BTW if you read this whole string to this point, WOW !!! you need to go outside and play PB.

[dre1919]

I posted a thread basically saying the same exact thing as this one awhile ago and most people who viewed it were like "Nah, paintball's not like that" and "If you don't like it, don't play". Well, that's the point...I DO like it and I'd LOVE to play. Unfortuantely, I can't play but only a few times a year because it became too expensive. However, it was not always this way. I started playing in '93 with rental pump guns back when that was really all there was. If you had a semi-auto Stingray you were the man. We used to play all day on 500 rounds and some Co2 and we had a blast. Two Saturdays a month we were out running around the woods having a great time and we spent maybe $30 per weekend. Now, we've evloved over the years into tournament styled speedball players using Angels and full gear. We can shoot through so much paint in a short amount of time it's ridiculous. Most games, 80% of that paint is shot as cover fire or to suppress the other teams movement so in essesence it's wasted paint, which means it's wasted money.

I think all the technological advancements are wonderful, and have really brought the sport into the mainstream as a "sport" and not some psuedo-paramilitary hobby. However, I truly believe paintball as a sport and industry is evolving itself out of business. Sooner or later, paint prices, field fees, and gun prices will be too high for anyone but the rich to afford. I am a prime example...I ate, slept, and breathed paintball for over seven years and now I rarely check on new items, rarely hit up AO and don't get to play but once in a great often. Most of the time, my gear bag does a great job holding down my floor. I don't have the money as a 29 year old to go out and spend $100 a weekend or more playing a game I still deeply love. It's become so ingrained in my thinking that playing "rec" or senario is a step down from the "level" I'm currently at (whatever that is) that I feel like those endeavors are less interesting. The perception and media is at work there. But, that's unimportant. The important thing is, at some point something will have to give with this sport and it's prices. I've taken many new people out to play games and they ALWAYS say the same thing..."I had a great time! This game is so much fun, I wish it were cheaper. If it was, I'd play all the time."

Playing's what's important to us, money is what's important to the industry. As long as we have the demand to play at all costs, why would manufacturers and fields ever change prices? It's going to take people simply deciding a particular price for a case of paint is too high, or a rate of fire is too much to finally break the cycle of escalation. Personally, as much as I love tournament paintball and dream of doing it often one day, I have essentially decided to pursue scenario ball as it is something I can afford to play. I will miss playing tourney and faster rec ball, but at the root of it all I want to PLAY...and with the prices the way they are now, I do precious little of that. For those of you who make high enough salaries to play at whatever cost, good for you. Enjoy your luck. For those of you kids who have money (whether it be your own or your parents)...just wait. When you're out on your own in your middle twenties and you can only play once every three months, you'll see things from where I stand.

[tyrion2323]

It's been like this for 10+ years, now the divide is greater between rental Spyders and e-guns. It's one of the reasons I take a Phantom with me when I play. "New guys? Cool. I'll grab the Phantom." If everyone did this, the problem wouldn't exist.
-Tyger

The answer isn't phantoms or old-school 'balling. The answer is better attitudes. And it's not only tournament players who pose a problem.