Thoughts on ION, SP, Hype.. other makers..

[ktMag]

From what I read about the Ion so far, I'm considering picking one up. Only thing stopping me from buying it is the long awaited PTP PnueMag Frame. I plan to slap that Pnue-Goodness onto my MicroMag and rekindle the bond I had with it.

However, IF the upgrade for a PTP's PnueMag Frame cost over $200... then I'm seriously going to think about buying an Ion instead.

Don't get me wrong.... I love my Mech Mag. But, it's feels like 5 lbs when it's fully setup (w/o paint) and it's a total GAS HOG. Not to mention the stock benchmark single trigger frame with a trigger pull heavy enough to make Superman cringe. After playing with my Mag for a day, it makes everything the Ion has to offer that much more attractive. Not to mention the Ion's cost.

There is a good chance that I'm going to be at Jungle Island on April 2 (Lake Elsinore, CA). If anyone has an Ion I can run 500 rounds at the firing range, PLEASE EMAIL ME. I'll supply the paint and air for the test. I wanna see for myself what this thing can do.

[GT]

oh and as far as bad business practice.. here's a quote from Smart Parts on the Nerve.

Sell off all the other junk you've purchased over the years to make your under performing marker a winner and make space in your gear bag for the Nerve

This comment makes no sense. Can you really, with complete honesty, tell me that one gun is truly better than any other?

[Lohman446]

This comment makes no sense. Can you really, with complete honesty, tell me that one gun is truly better than any other?

I don't know, this thread is about why the Ion sucks it seems.

Ok, its about hype, about why the mag is such a smarter buy than teh Ion and why do the idiot paintball players spend there money on anything else.

At least to some people

[MadPSIence]

A nerve is better than a Talon

[Glickman]

It only makes sense a non-structural part be made out of plastic.

The Ions I saw at open play this weekend were working great. This is the low cost future gun people have been wanting.

Let's see:

[x]speed
[x]size
[x]weight
[x]cost
[x]Oh, wait. It's Smart Parts. We have to hate it!

How about a pages-long rant about the lunacy of spending hundreds of dollars on a mechanical Mag or Autococker? My mech 'cocker and Sandridge were already old, now they're relics.

even at 14 posts, i like ya already

very well put

[JimmyBeam]

aparently you didn't notice the " " marks, which means I'm quoting other people. I have heard that said many times on these forums and others. Also, my rant wasen't necessarily about SP, it was a rant toward the people that buy the supplies, and the fact that they fall so easily to advertising/hype, so much to where they seem to forget that just a few months before they hated the company they just bought something from.

my bad

[jewie27]

It's not hype.....

I tested out my co-worker's new Ion on Saturday. He paid $290 for it.

I adjusted the trigger for him and it absolutely rips. It's pretty consistent on the velocity; +/- 3fps.

The trigger is NOT crap and I know this for a fact. It's not like a $300 trigger but it works well.

Easy to setup. Out of the box, it just needs a velocity adjustment.

The marker only uses Shocker lube or Dow Corning 55 grease.

Grease only, no oil.



Best thing of all, it has eyes for a great price. Lots of modes built in too.

1.)fast
2.)adjustable trigger
3.)many modes
4.) great price

[LONEWOLFOO1]

Has anybody thought as this gun being a cheap back up for your main gun 300 is not bad as a back up right now i have a tac one and a 2000 bm2k i was think about putting eyes on my bm2k and make it a tourney level gun but this sp product may make this gun sit in the case.

i would wait six months though to buy another gun.

[deathstalker]

I think one thing you've forgotten to mention is how hypocritical people have gotten. About 1/2 to a year ago people were bashing SP about the lawsuits , their "bad business" ideals and so on.... but now, they put out a new marker and everyone seems to magically love SP again. Personally I think this is pretty annoying at how smaller companies like AGD, PMI, and others try so hard to become great, and all SP has to do to bring people back to them is put out a new low end gun. 'course then i just remember at how this sport is fairly dominated by high schoolers that don't think about how they sound.

First, SP bashing is as popular now with the ION as it was when the lawsuits began. What you think is people magically falling in love with SP I see as some of the more open-minded and intelligent people speaking their mind.

Second, SP has raised the bar for other companies. AGD is hardly bothering to compete at all, let alone with companies targeting tournament players and new players. You think companies should just sit back and rest on their laurels, saying, "Come buy our stuff because we made it!"? That certainly creates competition, doesn't it? Companies like AGD and PMI (and many others) haven't changed their products enough to meet the demands of the growing and changing industry. I love AGD's products and my primary marker is an awesome display of what they can do. However, the falling prices of competitor's products are allowing me to try more and more products, giving me the best way of comparing the pros and cons of different markers.

I recently picked up a B2K4 PDS and fell in love with it. I've seen blemished models going for under $300, too, and considered picking up a second. When I first received it, I couldn't stand the microswith and trigger spring, complaining how magnets, HES, and optical sensors have spoiled me. Once I aired it up, it was like day and night. I can rip on it so easily that I have a sneaky suspicion I'm outshooting my E-Mag. I would never have discovered the joy that is a Bushy had they not been so cheap. Even the soon-to-be-released B2K5 is starting off at $460.

While I might not have ever considered spending $400+ for an Impulse or $600+ for a Shocker, I would readily spend under $275 for an ION. Based on what I've been seeing this round of pre-orders, competition amongst the dealers will be intense and it won't be long before they're dirt cheap. SP has forced the other manufacturers to compete if they want to survive. I look forward to the next generation of markers designed to compete directly with the ION.

Finally, SP makes sure people know about their products. What most people call "hype" I simply call "advertising". Can you describe the last Pimp ad you saw? How many print ads did you see for the X-Mag? I know for a fact that many people really do base their buying decisions on an advertisement, only because it allows them to see a product. The actual content is irrelevant, because people pay more attention the pictures than the words. Dear god, how many people won't bother to read my post because they look at it and say, "Words, uhh, words..."? There are still quite a few households without internet access, so many people don't have the interaction with other players those of us on the web do.

The other thing about advertising and paintball is the current average age of players, average age of people playing for the first time, and, as a direct result of the first two things mentioned, the people who are spending money on new gear. It's not just the players themselves, it's also their parents. This is certainly no rant against "those spoiled brats", as I usually stay out of those threads as well, but the fact of the matter is the industry has changed a lot since it's birth over 20 years ago. Consider this:

1. Not only are children more impressionable than adults, they are also more prone to exaggerate and distort information they repeat.
2. Children are less patient than adults and aren't willing to spend the time researching their purchases and therefore do not make educated consumers.
3. Peer pressure has been, is, and will continue to be a powerful force exerted on children. "Keeping up with the Joneses" does not apply simply to adults.
4. Many parents leaf through magazines and read ads when making buying decisions for their children. This is what they consider researching and good parenting. We spend so much time complaining that parents don't interact with their children enough, yet we don't spend any time teaching parents how to successfully do it.
5. The use of electronics in markers and hoppers have made comparing them much more difficult, even at the level of your budget-priced sear-tripper.

Companies like Kingman and Tippman have long withstood the criticism leveled at "newbie" guns, but they've managed to succeed. Why? The biggest reason is the value they offer consumers. For under $200, one can purchase a kit that simply requires them to gas up and load paintballs before they hit the field. There are plenty of upgrades available, both OEM and aftermarket, and the amount of available support is incredible. The second reason they've been so successful is they got out the word about their products. Considering how many sub-$150 markers are on the market, one has to take the extra step to lead the way.

I started typing this last night and decided to wait until this morning to post it. I have learned to keep my mouth shut on topics like this, preferring to let the closed-minded and ignorant embarass themselves, but every once in a while a thread raises my ire and forces me to react. The release of the ION is going to change the industry again and only for the better. Consumers will have more choices and cheaper prices, other companies can make aftermarket parts for it, and SP's competitor's will be forced to step up to the plate and offer something new.

Paintballers have been complaining about things within the sport and industry for decades (pump vs. semi, woods vs. concept, rec vs. tourney, gun X vs. gun Y, manufacturer A vs. manufacturer B, etc.). All this has shown me is we are our own worst enemy. If we let the game itself split us apart, how could we ever expect to stand united against outside interference? If people could only look at the big picture rather than just a small piece of the puzzle, maybe more people could realize the benefits big companies bring to the game. Smart Parts isn't the cause of the problem, YOU are.

[LONEWOLFOO1]

http://www.smartparts.com/PR/IonVideo.aspx

They take WALK THE TALK to a whole new level.

[VFX_Fenix]

Dear god, how many people won't bother to read my post because they look at it and say, "Words, uhh, words..."?

I have to wonder the same thing occationally.... Good post

[Lee]

[*]Not only are children more impressionable than adults, they are also more prone to exaggerate and distort information they repeat.[*]Children are less patient than adults and aren't willing to spend the time researching their purchases and therefore do not make educated consumers.[*]Peer pressure has been, is, and will continue to be a powerful force exerted on children. "Keeping up with the Joneses" does not apply simply to adults.[*]Many parents leaf through magazines and read ads when making buying decisions for their children. This is what they consider researching and good parenting. We spend so much time complaining that parents don't interact with their children enough, yet we don't spend any time teaching parents how to successfully do it.[*]The use of electronics in markers and hoppers have made comparing them much more difficult, even at the level of your budget-priced sear-tripper.[/list]

and it seems smart parts has or is on it's way to mastering the use of this info, which is not a bad thing, and i like that it'll bring more people into it because they feel they can compete right out of the box.

this marker also appeals to experienced players as shown by several posts from various people on this forum.

heck, i've been playing awhile and i picked one up and have used mine the last couple times i played. i'm very impressed with it overall and enjoy using it. i think it's one of the better paintball purchases i've made over the years.

like 'em or hate 'em, smart parts has hit the mark imho.

[Vendetta]

Does anyone know if SP is acutally making a profit on the sale of these? I wonder if they are selling these below cost as another marketting ploy? If so, I can see people "moving up" from Ions to Nerves-Shockers. Very sneaky, and smart

[Lohman446]

Funny, I had that conversation once and I am assured that SP is making money on these. Looking at the materials I can see it - I mean how much do the materials actually cost. And if the rumor is true that this was a discarded 03 Shocker design internally, meaning little R&D costs, I expect they are making a decent profit.

[LONEWOLFOO1]

yeah its called brand loyalty. honda, nissan, toyota has that hands down maybe sp is learning from car manufactures. most people that own a honda civic would upgrade to a accord then from the accord to a tsx or tl everybody wants repeat customers.