Dan Tiljack Cheats with WALK-ONS?

[Tyger]

But let me guess, you will now try to come back and try to prove that I am at fault here and make the issue one about me.

No need. You did a better job than I ever could.

[Tyger]

I have seen more cheating in rec woodsball games than all of your videos combined. If I had a camera I would prove this but alas I am poor. I understand you want a good clean game but that has to do with the person holding the gun, not what type of game he plays.

And when I film cheaters on the woods fields, they will be on the web in 48 hours or so. At Paintball Sams, after I took the camera off for the day, a player on my team wiped a hit in front of me. I was torqued off that I missed that shot, as I would have put it in online for you to see.

Again, I'm an equal opportunity bastard. Right now it's winter, so I'm limited from filming outdoor games. But once Spring comes back, I'm SURE I'll catch my share of jerks in the woods. When I do, you'll see it.

[Lohman446]

My opinion, and my advise to field owners / managers / refs is that Tyger has just made it harder for those of us who do not try to stir the pot. I make no judgement on if that is right or wrong...

That being said, there would be an explicit rule at any field I ran that stated there would be no filming or photography without written permission. I will trust Tyger when he says he did not do it, but I do not need someone, in the future, editing a video in a disparaging way towards where I work / play.

[TDonovan]

The thread on pbn died, they don't like heated debate. I don't agree that Tiljack was really trying to cheat or lie, like it was said, he seemed a LOT like he just wanted to avoid confrontation (which IMO is a good thing). The guy coaching was a punk, and people like that really do ruin games. It's INCREDIBLY tough to be a rec player, and one credit to this video is that it shows that. It shows the low quality of the reffing in many cases (smoking on the field), the lack of enforcing of important rules (nobody wants to go blind because of a lack of a barrel condom), and the lack of respect for rec players. I feel bad for the guys that pay a $25 field fee, $75 case of paint, and $20 rental fee to have some punk coaching from the sidelines and ruining their experience. It's why I avoid playing rec at all costs...

I also like the FPS video footage itself. What kinda camera setup are you using to do that Tyger? I'd love to hook one of those up and catch the game from my perspective.

And when I film cheaters on the woods fields, they will be on the web in 48 hours or so. At Paintball Sams, after I took the camera off for the day, a player on my team wiped a hit in front of me. I was torqued off that I missed that shot, as I would have put it in online for you to see.

Again, I'm an equal opportunity bastard. Right now it's winter, so I'm limited from filming outdoor games. But once Spring comes back, I'm SURE I'll catch my share of jerks in the woods. When I do, you'll see it.

Why film a cheater on your team when you can just shoot them in the back until they leave?

It's almost more fun shooting cheaters than shooting at the other team. I nailed this one dude in the butt like 3 times before he finally caught me shooting at him. I was rolling around laughing because he jumped about a foot and grabbed his cheeks. THATS when the hit he wiped off his goggles reappeared when the other team lit him up. I just got sick of seeing the guy cheat ALL day and decided it would be fun to do my own vigilante-style reffing.

[punkncat]

I caught him in a lie. If he's casually lying about playing in tournaments, then it opens the door to ask what else he's lying about, or being mistruthful about.

What was so bad about this guy wanting to play a game of paintball w/o people hounding him about who he was? Have you never ever told a little white lie in order to smooth over a possible situation? Did his neglecting to tell people who he was honestly affect anyone?
Were you forthright about the fact that you were filming everyone? Is a lie of omission better than a spoken one?

... 'Put the bad spin on Tyger's video',...

You created the video with a bad spin. No one had to do that for you.

I did mention the safety problems to the field staff, they blew me off, so that proves to me they didn't care.

Is there a big safety issue with using a barrel cleaner over a barrel bag? Was the barrel not effectively blocked? Making an issue of that was like splitting hairs. I can see no reason why that wasn't as safe if not safer than using a cover.
On top of that who made it your job to say or do anything about it? Once it was mentioned to a ref that should have been the end of it. Although to be honest I cannot see where it warrented such attention. The owner didn't think so, the ref didn't think so, and none of the other players thought so. Were we looking for some sort of moral high ground? Just trying to create a situation for the sake of your own amusement?

and I caught his friend saying he would "come after" me on the field

I think we can all see that this was not meant as a real threat. I am not really seeing how anyone can spin it into coming off like one.


And my question still goes unanswered. Why did you set out to make such a big situation out of this? Were you playing towards a goal unknown to the other players? Why did YOU choose to make this into such an ordeal?

I think the problem involves the fact that you were unable to film yourself eliminating a "big tourney player". That would have been real nice huh? The brass ring? Another notch in the belt.....You acted like a jilted schoolgirl. Made a big deal out of something that should have been brushed off. It meant nothing. The spin was for nothing more than your own ego.


Beyond this particular video I must say I have enjoyed watching many of the ones you have made in the past. I think it would come across much better in the future if it would remain along the lines of an impartial documentary and allow the audience to draw their own conclusions rather than being steered towards yours.

[p8ntball72]

FYI,
Any field Insured by PBA, NSERA, or the APL REQUIRE a barrel condom to even have Insurance.

any field owner, Ref, or player that thinks otherwise is not only jepordising our safty but is also VOIDING insurance coverage in case of catastrophic accident.

requirments that MUST be met to even have insurance..
Per the NSERA.


Per the APL.
9) PROPER BARREL PLUG REGULATION...
All players are required to have paintball marker barrels blocked or plugged with a device
specifically designed for blocking the ball if the marker is accidentally fired, at all times other than
while in game areas, target range, or at the chronograph area.

[hitech]

I caught him in a lie.

It sounded to me like he was avoiding a confrontation. Considering what he had just witnessed it seems like a reasonable action to me.

[Tyger]

And my question still goes unanswered. Why did you set out to make such a big situation out of this? Were you playing towards a goal unknown to the other players? Why did YOU choose to make this into such an ordeal?

I think the problem involves the fact that you were unable to film yourself eliminating a "big tourney player".

Again, I didn't know who he was 'till he decided to lie. Then I asked one question to one employee, and found out. If I want video of eliminating a "Big tourney player", there are fields I could go to for that. And I could EASILY do it. If tht were my goal.

Funny thing is EVERYONE else is making a big deal out of the situation. Not once have I screamed "HE CHEATED!", You all put that in my mouth, saying what I wanted to do. I've already said the goal over and over, but again. It's what happened. No editing, no BS, it's what happened. This is the goal of the series. To put out there what's happening, not what other people claim is happening.

I highlighted that situation because of many reasons, it was the best footage, for starters. It was a big deal in the night, as many people commented to me that the guy calling my spot out was "BS" WHILE I was still there. In post I had good footage, with some clarity, so it goes in. Look, it would not have mattered WHO it was, it happened. It was good footage, and it's controversy won't make me balk at the situation. You all can claim to know my "true motives" and what I'm "really" up to, but the reality is that you're putting your own spin and bias on the work to fit your own agendas, whatever they are.

And, again, let me restate that I had NO clue who was behind the bunker. He was the last guy in, I had the field position to make the move unseen, so I did. The field setup is such that from the center back you can't look up the middle but you can suppress both sides. So I made the move, a move that was called out by a spectator and tipping off the player behind the bunker. My plan was to make it to his bunker, listen for which side he was shooting out of, then move to the other side for a 1-ball shot. And if it worked, good. If it didn't oh well. Wouldn't matter who was there, it was a move to eliminate the last guy on the field.

No ammount of explanations will convince you folks tho, it seems. I can't state things any more plainly without being condecending.

[lather]

Tyger,

Why didnt you give Tiljack the benefit of the doubt and offered him one of your BBD's? If he refuses then bring it up with the field reps. If he decided to curse or fight with you instead then perhaps you have something worthy of posting on the internet.

When you asked Tiljack if he was a tourney player would you have been more sastified if he said "none of your frickin business?"

Other than the jerk on the sidelines, all this video reveals is that there is a drama queen with a pump.

[Beemer]

Oh Please

Is there a big safety issue with using a barrel cleaner over a barrel bag? Was the barrel not effectively blocked? Making an issue of that was like splitting hairs. I can see no reason why that wasn't as safe if not safer than using a cover.
On top of that who made it your job to say or do anything about it? Once it was mentioned to a ref that should have been the end of it. Although to be honest I cannot see where it warrented such attention. The owner didn't think so, the ref didn't think so, and none of the other players thought so. Were we looking for some sort of moral high ground? Just trying to create a situation for the sake of your own amusement?

Are you for real? A safety rule is a safety rule, period. this guy knew it and didnt Care.
Are you one of those uninformed, uneducated players I keep talking about. Split hairs my butt, you dont see no reason because you are not informed and educated in Paintball safety.
Will you think it warrents attention when somebodys eye gets shot out?????

What ever.............Tyger got burned for sure and as an ex SemiPro player all I can say is you NEVER would catch me breaking a MAJOR safety rule. Thats the whole problem, players today have no respect for SAFETY or The RULES.


As for the rest, the pot is already stirred. To bad you dont like what ya see. Welcome to paintball 2006

____________

[Tyger]

Why didnt you give Tiljack the benefit of the doubt and offered him one of your BBD's? If he refuses then bring it up with the field reps. If he decided to curse or fight with you instead then perhaps you have something worthy of posting on the internet.

When you asked Tiljack if he was a tourney player would you have been more sastified if he said "none of your frickin business?"

1) I didn't have any to spare, as I was traveling "light" that night. I had the one for my paintgun.

2) Actually, yes. That would have been a better answer. Or "Yes" would have sufficed. Or even "I have." or "I really don't want to get into that." or just raw silence.

And let me ask this. When a pro player goes berserk on a referee (yelling, shooting them, having to be physically manhandled off the field) for missing a call or making a call against them, why is that "ok", but when I take offense at someone interfering with the game, that's being a "Drama Queen"? And why is it that when another famous person goes on a ref on film, that's overlooked? Double standard, or a case that they don't talk so they're no fun?

[Lohman446]

And let me ask this. When a pro player goes berserk on a referee (yelling, shooting them, having to be physically manhandled off the field) for missing a call or making a call against them, why is that "ok", but when I take offense at someone interfering with the game, that's being a "Drama Queen"? And why is it that when another famous person goes on a ref on film, that's overlooked?

I don't recall anyone here saying such an action was "ok" or even saying the actions of the spectator were ok. Aside from one person who said it was within the rules and I have already stated my question of that assertion.

[thecavemankevin]

I have no anger twords Dan, in fact I could care less who he is except he lied. If he would have said "Yeah, I play in some tournaments" there would be no problem. But if you lie casually it questions everything else that you do. What else is a lie, or a mistruth? What esle would you casually drop to feed your own purposes?

"Let he who without sin cast the first stone." So do you mean to tell me you have never told a lie? It seems fairly clear to me that TilJack was simply trying to defuse the situation. he saw how you confronted the sideline jerkoff and likely thought it would be better to do all he could to simply stay away from you and possible physical and verbal agression.
Did he lie to you? Yes, but who are you that he has to tell you the truth. Was he sworn in a in a court of law? No

did he cheat? (and i know you never said he did tyger). NO

I did mention the safety problems to the field staff, they blew me off, so that proves to me they didn't care. Is it an "Aggressive" stance if fun involves overshooting other customers? If I showed up to your field, and lit up people saying "It's how I play" You'd throw me out. IF a pro player does the same, do you give him preferential treatment? Apparently, some fields do.

Did he do anything wrong? Yes, He didnt use the proper BBD. You say you told the staff, and perhaps you did, perhaps you didnt. But we certainly never saw you inform the staff that Tiljack was violating the rules. But you were also a party to it because you noticed it and as far as we saw in your video you did nothing about it. Therefore, its similar to if you and a buddy rob a bank and your buddy kills a teller in the process. you are also responsible for that tellers death.

And on a final note, you say actions speak louder than words. Then I tell you to look at my actions. Did I yell at Dan? Did I challenge him to a fight? Did I get in his face? No. I caught him in a lie

I am looking at your actions and i still see you as being a sensationalistic quasi journalist. No you didnt yell at him, but you did briefly confront him. Again, you caught him in a lie, so what are your feelings hurt or something? Whats the big deal?

[thecavemankevin]

Again, I didn't know who he was 'till he decided to lie. Then I asked one question to one employee, and found out.

And, again, let me restate that I had NO clue who was behind the bunker. He was the last guy in, I had the field position to make the move unseen, so I did.

you know that if he were just joe blow player this thread wouldnt exist right now. Your video would, but you certainly would have not made such an issue of "he lied to me, oh poor me, what will i ever do?"

hey, he's a dude, he's going to lie to chicks like you like all of use guys do.

so why don't you stop crying and instead take the time to get the sand out of your vagina?

[Steelrat]

you know that if he were just joe blow player this thread wouldnt exist right now. Your video would, but you certainly would have not made such an issue of "he lied to me, oh poor me, what will i ever do?"

hey, he's a dude, he's going to lie to chicks like you like all of use guys do.

so why don't you stop crying and instead take the time to get the sand out of your vagina?

Whoops, this thread just jumped the shark.