AGD really let me down at PSP (long)

[Evil Bob]

No prob, lamby, the information you just provided gives us alot more info on your tech level and what you attempted that was not provided in the first half of this thread. It adds more credibility to your claims about what happened.

I know the TL63 trigger comes a bit closer to the body then the stock trigger does, its possible this may be where the trigger bounce problem lies. See if you can replicate the problem with the stock trigger if you still have it.

AGD is doing the new on/off to reduce trigger pull weight by 66%, reduced reaction is a byproduct and not the goal of the new addition. Tom said if they reduced the reactivity too much, it will adversely affect the cycling speed.

-Evil Bob

[IcantBelieveit]

soo uhh, can someone explaing the exact rule and what exactly the problem was, and why peopld had to remove thier trigger rod?

[Halliday]

Originally posted by Evil Bob
........Therefore, it is no longer required to chrono an Emag/Xmag in mechanical mode, any ref who requires you to do this is uninformed and needs a little education on the modern AutoMag........

-Evil Bob

Whoa! That's the first time I've ever seen that! I have always thought RT's, RTP's and E/X-Mag were to be chronied the same way.

[cphilip]

It was never "required". thats not what Evil means by using that word. It was just "best" to do it that way. You can crono them in emode you just have to adjust some and give up some so as not to get a hot shot or you might risk a blooper cold shot too. The procedure was to get the best balance of the RT valve. It was never required as a tourney requirement. It was never a "Rule".

[AutomagRT1483]

Originally posted by Miscue
/me has a proposed solution for refs.

A little metal sleeve that says "Classic" valve on it... that slips over the RT.

:)

I loving that idea Where can I get one of those?

[nerobro]

Just as an FYI, the emag will not ship with the ULE trigger. Beucase of the weight of the solinoid plunger and other parts the ULE trigger signifigantly slows down the speed the sear will return. So, no AGD wouldn't have the new on/off's for you. And they aren't even reccomended for emag use. The ULE on/offs won't be released for another month as well!

You're complaining about a part you wouldn't have been given. The only thing you MIGHT have gotten was a longer on/off pin. And you're running an aftermarket trigger anyway.

*thinks about it* If you're so concerned about reactivity. put in a stock mag on/off. that should have next to no reactivity.

[DjGruv]

The Emag needs to be cronod like an RT. So YEs the trigger rod needs to be in.

[MarkM]

Ok I have kept out of this for a while as it all had "seemed" to have calmed down than I look around and then the thread jumps back up

I was the Judge at the Cup last year, who as noted by Cphilip stopped AGD and NON AGD markers. The AGD Lions (didn't know that it was them as to me one team is just that another team) changed their input pressues and dwells to allow them to go on the field and the following day they had disabled the manual mode. The list of markers refused to be allowed on the field as set was a long one and they were made by all companies and they weren't all stopped for bouncing :). The AGD ones are just a little easier to bounce if badly setup. The problems that AGD Lions had at the chrono station were complained about at the time and the Head judge was called to the field along with Moose and the ruling upheld, a couple of other teams complained aswell and again the Head judge and or Moose was called and the ruling upheld....every time. One particular player from another team who had been stopped swapped out his marker 3 times and 3 times the "new" marker bounced...he ended up not playing that game. This judge who is being mentioned as the cause of this thread (amongst other reasons) was being over zealous. I personally want to fire an E-Mag in manual if I can't, then nor can the player so if I can't bounce it then nor can the player though some will bounce in electro only, rare but possible, in an ideal world as obviously I only get to play with the marker for a couple of minutes tops and the player knows where his trigger is set way better than me. Just thought I would throw this in the mix. As I was being mentioned, not that any of you knew I was reading it until now I am equally fair or harsh (depends on your view) to every team that arrives to chrono on a field no one gets any favours...I don't travel god knows how many thousands of miles to screw over a team I "may" have read about or don't even know.

[cphilip]

Originally posted by DjGruv
The Emag needs to be cronod like an RT. So YEs the trigger rod needs to be in.

That Sir is incorrect. It should be...but it does not HAVE to be. As evident by several who have competed doing it in emode and I myself have tried it. Its not preferable but its possible and does function however a bit impared. It will get you in the game in better shape than this fellow ended up.

[magman007]

Lamby, i want to know, how do you feel comming in here and *****ing about how this marker is not "top level" when Brimstone smoke walked away with the 10 man and the Kids took the 5 man in their respective divisions? brimstone smoke has atleast 2 if not more mags on it, and we know the kids are all magged. So, i think you shouls stick your foot in your mouth regarding the part where you say it isnt top level.

[Farnja]

I dont know a lot about emags and how they work but could you not have chronoed the gun w/ the trigger rod to get the "highest rapid fire velocity" and then taken it back out for the game, the velocity wont go higher and the gun will work fine in e-mode... I am probably wrong but that sounds logical....

[cphilip]

Originally posted by MarkM
I was the Judge at the Cup last year, who as noted by Cphilip stopped AGD and NON AGD markers. The AGD Lions (didn't know that it was them as to me one team is just that another team) changed their input pressues and dwells to allow them to go on the field and the following day they had disabled the manual mode. The list of markers refused to be allowed on the field as set was a long one and they were made by all companies and they weren't all stopped for bouncing :). The AGD ones are just a little easier to bounce if badly setup. The problems that AGD Lions had at the chrono station were complained about at the time and the Head judge was called to the field along with Moose and the ruling upheld, a couple of other teams complained aswell and again the Head judge and or Moose was called and the ruling upheld....every time.

And that is all because your interpretation was correct and indeed upheld because it was correct. I have had no problems with how you handled it and even said so last year when this came up. It was evenly applied and it has always been the rule.

[TheJester]

i have worked on a micro e several times that has been threw several tournies with out a problem. the only reason he never liked it was cause pro-team would always send it back in rough condition. but to quote mike "ever since nate worked on it, it's wonderful" all i did for him was tune his lvl 10 so it wouldn't screw anything up. but this is also after 3 tournies that have been played with it by either him or other people. an emag is by all means a tournament level gun. it sounds like you kind of brought it upon yourself. i don't see why you mokeyed with everything, the emag trigger is easy enough to walk, why not just spend that time to tune your trigger pull a little more so you don't rely on hybrid and use the e only mode, or hell, don't be a wuss and just use the mechanical. i still fail to see where this is AGD's fault

[MarkM]

Originally posted by cphilip



And that is all because your interpretation was correct and indeed upheld because it was correct. I have had no problems with how you handled it and even said so last year when this came up. It was evenly applied and it has always been the rule.

Thanks for the kind words...and to be honest I didn't recall you saying so at the time but then it was hellishly hot I only replied to the thread to give my side of things as the subject had been brought up, you yourself had already said it was done even handed but then how often does one post get ignored in a heated thread? I will be over again for the Cup, so drop by and say hi.

[cphilip]

Oh not at the field Mark. But next year I will introduce myself.

It was when I got back from Florida and it came up here on the forums. At WC I would have not associated with you for fear of reprisal! Just kidding ya mate.