Is this what Tom "really" thinks of AO?

[DWill]

I may of seem a little unreasonable in that last post...allow me to clarify.

I have no problems with people wanting their marker to look pretty...it is when people start judgeing the better marker purely on looks that makes me upset...and when people say they are judgeing on performace when they are really judgeing on looks that makes me even more upset. I think the X-mag is one of the best looking markers out there, and I would gladly own one if I had the cash (I am not a bum for nothing!)...just my .02 cents

[Heebs]

Heh, perhaps TK should market everything to us pump players, we seem to have an appreciation for things that arent "norm."

Heebs - Official PhOG Poser

[Bucky]

All of these ideas seem really great, but it seems sad to just talk about them instead of actually making it happen.

Tom, how large a sum of money does it take to create a new gun like this? And, (this part for the AO members) if we could convince you to do this, would people donate money to help research this not as an investment, but more like a leap of faith in the progression of the sport of paintball, so Tom would not have to take such a great hit to his bank account on something that might not take flight?

Just a few thoughts.

[luke]

[Plazmic]

In a little bit of a bad mood, there, loke? As I recall, having actually read this thread through, Tom asked for our ideas and, specifically, for ideas on what problem we see in paintball that might need a solution.

[AGD]

As an example of what it takes to develop really new technology, it took 5 engineers 8 months of full time work to fully develop the RT valve system. That 5x8= 40 man months if you were working alone or 3.3 YEARS. And the RT valve was an already functioning prototype from 1991.

In order to properly develop a completely new valve system that would be superior to everything out there we would allot somewhere between 2-300 thousand dollars over two years. That is the money you would gamble on development without knowing if would actually work or not.

AGD

[DWill]

Originally posted by luke

I agree...it is a real bummer to think that something so great that could of revolutionized paintball will not be devolped because of the paintball communitie's narrow-mindess as a whole, save for a few induviduals.

[Plazmic]

Originally posted by AGD
As an example of what it takes to develop really new technology, it took 5 engineers 8 months of full time work to fully develop the RT valve system. That 5x8= 40 man months if you were working alone or 3.3 YEARS. And the RT valve was an already functioning prototype from 1991.

In order to properly develop a completely new valve system that would be superior to everything out there we would allot somewhere between 2-300 thousand dollars over two years. That is the money you would gamble on development without knowing if would actually work or not.

AGD

That's not too bad from an R&D viewpoint, but from a company owner's viewpoint, that's harsh. Okay, I'll start buying as many parts as I can for my mag so you can develope a new valve for us.

Who else is in? If everyone buys just one new upgrade this month, maybe we give AGD a nice boost and Tom'll think about doing some really nice R&D for us. Yeah?

Edit: Uh, let's make that next month. There's only a few days left in this one.

[felony]

Originally posted by AGD
That is the money you would gamble on development without knowing if would actually work or not.

AGD

That is an awfully big gamble to take, and would never take it myself in position but if you know it could change the paintball world, maybe you should.

I totally agree with what someone said earlier. People are still gonna say its just a Mag. blah blah. I was @ the field today and watching people with those great new 03 shockers chopping ball after ball. my teamates matrix was have MEAN drop off. I saw another back player take his barrel off of his shocker to properly clean a chop or some junk like that. Let me think of some more problems. Uh the standard cocker not working, etc etc.

I talk with some of my friends and with some other players and ask them why not just use a mag? My emag shoots just as fast as thier markers. It is a fairly small profile. It doesnt chop. It is as accurate at those cockers out there . Most of the time they say, "well, its mag" or something extremly stupid like that.

Certain guns are for certain people. Some want a solid, performing, easy to work with marker. thats why i got an emag. i dont think it is terrible sexy.

If I wanted to spend 1000 on a matrix to sit @ the chrono fixing junk, I probably would have left paintball a long time ago.

I don't know Tom. It is even tough for me to decide what to do with your money . My current requests, as everyone elses have to do with efficiency, battery size(i like the batt pack, just not weight), and maybe a nice integrated rail/body, but none of these expand past he current user market.

good luck

dan

[breg]

My $.02:

One of the things that I think is wrong with paintball in generalis that people want form over function. It's a sad truth, but looks are the most important part in seclecting so many things.
The problem that Tom might have is that he is too much the engineer. While the regular folk will hear the specs and what not on his products, but people shop with eyes and not ears. While that is truly unfortunate, it is a fact. Not everyone is willing to put much research into buying a marker. They will listen to their friends and buy what they use, or they will buy what they see in the glossy pages of a given paintball magazine. Another problem is that there is so much marking hype that has been taken as paintball fact. There is little that can be done to teach people differently. Like when I tried to explain to someone once that all markers fire from a closed bolt; their only response was, "Let's see what my buddy Bud Orr has to say about that."

As for what i would like to see from AGD... well better availibility for the X Mags would be nice. As well as a custom E-mag package similar to the Custom RT/Pro. That would be a great!

[shartley]

[luke]

Originally posted by Plazmic
In a little bit of a bad mood, there, loke? As I recall, having actually read this thread through, Tom asked for our ideas and, specifically, for ideas on what problem we see in paintball that might need a solution.

[luke]

Originally posted by shartley

[sneakyhacker420]

i could care less about fancy aesthetics

i own 5 mags and think that they are the sexiest thing alive from top-of the line now, to top-of-the line in 1994

X-Mag to Classic RT, its all here, and i love them all


overall i love AGD, and will ALWAYS have atleast one Mag in my lineup



the ONLY thing that i would like to see from AGD is an interesting idea IMO, have a sluggo body that uses an internal aluminum sleeve, like the empire timmys

so you can ano the body and sleeve a different color, and have through-the-body milling that exposes the different colored sleeve inside... this is also an example of the adrenalin impulse's air chambers, aardvark matrices, texas storm timmy, ripper timmy, ironman timmy, and a bunch of others

[Meph]

Originally posted by DWill
AO has another tendacy to say that they will buy a certain item in huge quantities, then when the item is released barely any sales at all, look at the z-grip and the rolling trigger for examples.

Z-grip is a valid example, everybody knows that. But you don't remember the roller trigger if you put that in the same category as the Z-grip!

Remember the posts? Tom showed this tiny little circle in the E-mag trigger. People loved it, and people wanted it and even with a pre-order before Tom officially made production.

What happened? That tiny little circle just barely sticking out the double trigger 'bump'.... turned into this giant bolt-on drill and tap attachment. People actually had to have a drill and tap to put this on, it wasn't even close to the same thing Tom had pictures of. Yes it was a convenient idea to have 2 seperate bearings to slap on, but at the same time that wasn't what the AO people saw or wanted. They saw the modified trigger with the bearing, but got that.

Not saying the performance wasn't there. I'm sure it worked the same performance wise. But damn there are just times when if you can make the same thing but make it look sexy.... the sexy one will be more desired and sell.

Now had Tom just taken a large pile of E-mag triggers and modified them to put that piece in place, despite of course it being in the way of the magnet screw. We might be looking at a different story with the Roller triggers.

I mean look at the 03Shocker. A company already made a trigger with about 4 'bumps' on it to give that roller effect. So you can't tell me that there isn't 0 demand for it if that ugly thing is selling. But of course same time I'm glad Tom did do a pre-order as he should have. Paintball players in general, not just AO, tend to say "Yeah man I want this, I'd pay mad dough for it!" But once it's there reality suddenly they lack the funds for it!