So, you can buy a NEW Mini Now?

[Tunaman]

Sam. I was fine with your post until you start stating WHY AGD is doing anything right now. You actually dont know jack about sales at AGD right now and have proved it by stating what you did. Sales are UP...by alot. Here, there, and everywhere. And posts like yours stating why they are doing what they are doing right now just have no merit whatsoever. It is no time to speculate on things you dont know when the new owner is looking for a little help. Please be more considerate as to AGD USA's reasons for doing anything. If you really want to know (seems you already know everything) why AGD USA is doing anything, then please call Dave and ask him.

[Tunaman]

[QUOTE=shartley]

[Tunaman]

How long will they be on the fields? How long will they be in business? About 20+ years so far, and most likely another 20. Hard to find many other marker manufacturers that can say the same....

[Wheelman]

The Mag will ALWAYS be a better marker due to the inherent design and quality.

I know I'm still tired from the trip, so my words may be jumbled (I'll try again after a good night sleep) I attemped to say the very thing you did Tuna, you read what it got me

I admit that I too don't know jack about the numbers at AGD, but I can tell you I'm not blind. I just take a look around me when I go to the fields to play, even in the backwood redneck areas of Maine I am seeing mags again in a new force (you'd think it was the 90's again) and many of these mag owners had never heard of AO they chose an automag because of the quality and design of a reliable marker they saw. From what I have seen I can't belive that AGD will go out of buisness anytime soon as other seem to belive.


I've owned a few mags over the years and a slew of everything else, and in the end I come back to AGD, no hype. I just wanted something that if I ever needed to mess with it, it was because I want to not because I need to. I bought my first one new before I knew what AO was, I did it because for one I liked the looks of it (can you belive that, even though it's "ugly") but also I knew something well built when I saw it.

Yeah I know it's my opinion, but hey I'm young and free and damn well entitled to it.

[shartley]

Sam. I was fine with your post until you start stating WHY AGD is doing anything right now. You actually dont know jack about sales at AGD right now and have proved it by stating what you did. Sales are UP...by alot. Here, there, and everywhere. And posts like yours stating why they are doing what they are doing right now just have no merit whatsoever. It is no time to speculate on things you dont know when the new owner is looking for a little help. Please be more considerate as to AGD USA's reasons for doing anything. If you really want to know (seems you already know everything) why AGD USA is doing anything, then please call Dave and ask him.

[QUOTE=Tunaman]

How long will they be on the fields? How long will they be in business? About 20 years so far, and most likely another 20. Hard to find many other marker manufacturers that can say the same....

[Wheelman]

Scott? Who is Scott? I thought Tuna's name was Robert. Is it that you dont know his first name, or are you just being disrespectful?

I did too, or are you on a last name only basis?


EDIT> Last part retracted because I don't want to overstep my bounds on lack of sleep.

[hobbesTZ]

Over the years it's become apparent to me that paintball is almost entirely based on opinion. As we've seen here any many of the other threads discussing differant paintball subjects there have been a million arguments. The trouble starts when we start taking opinions as facts. Personally, I don't like RT 'mags. I think you need an adjustable reg. to get it to work well. I think LVL 10 sucks, it's a touchy design, I don't want to drive my gun back into the gear bag over one microscopic fit issue (I hate on/off pins). AKA Sidewinders are hyped to hell and back, but mine has been just like anything else I've used. A lot of people say Intimidators are cheap POS, I disagree it's definately 90% user error (I've seen people that didn't know how to remove the detents). Tippmanns are a better value than the mags, especially at AGDs price. Once you start adding all the new stuff you run into reliablility issues that weren't there before, but all these are my opinions that I've concluded to through experiance, and I nobody can change my mind until I see whatever it is myself.

Enough rambling, I'm hungry and I'm going to make a sammich

[shartley]

Scott? Who is Scott? I thought Tuna's name was Robert. Is it that you dont know his first name, or are you just being disrespectful?

Gotta agree with this one too. What you see, and what is actually happening are two completely different things.

Just because you dont see it at your local field, or read it in a book doesnt mean it isnt happening. Hasty generalization.

I did too, or are you on a last name only basis?


EDIT> Last part retracted because I don't want to overstep my bounds on lack of sleep.

[Tunaman]

no problem Sam. Its all good.

[bleachit]

i dono why anyone would buy a minimag anyway. And i can say this because ive owned one for over a year and a half now. They are not good. Its that simple. They are heavy, slow, and just expensive. A spyder can outshoot a minimag out of its box, and just to get your mag to shoot with a still heavy but lighter trigger pull, you have to either upgrade to a new 250$ valve, buy a 140$ trigger frame, or spend 40$ on a ULT. Also, you have to pay for your gun not to chop. Once youve got your gun "up to par" you could have bought almost any gun (some would have to be used) out there. I realized that about half way through and gave up. My mag would never shoot the way that a 700$ gun should.

ULT, Trigger frame, and $250 valve are all unneccesary, just like the endless supply of expensive spyder upgrades. and you dont have to pay to have your gun not chop.. although Kingman now has an anti chop bolt.. that you pay for, to have your spyder not chop.

am I the only one who thinks that if you have an electro hopper feeding faster than your max rof that you wont chop?

if you are going to say a spyder can outshoot a minimag, maybe you should specify which spyder.. as there are quite a few out there. only an electro spyder could outshoot a mag. a stock mech spyder trigger is long pre and post travel. The mag is harder but shorter, its a nice crisp trigger. which can actually result in a higher rof than a mech spyder.

If you were referring to an electro spyder, then sure, the spyder could outshoot a mag.. but then if you arent using full auto, trying to walk the trigger, or fan it or whatever will result in not the best accuracy.. where as the stock mag, at near its max rof out of box will put its paint on target due to less recoil and a more stable hold on the gun... well that will depend on how you fire your marker and how the tank is set up. but from my experience shooting an electro spyder my shots were far less accurate than the same set up with a mech frame, or my mag I had used previously.

[teufelhunden]

And another little thing that is starting to piss me off. If you decide that you want to come here and bash Mags, your post will be deleted. I will do it personally. This is a mag forum for mag owners and other gun owners alike. We dont bash other guns around here so neither will any of you bash mags. Take it to your "other " forums and do it there. If you haven't already realized what is going on, there are new owners at AGD and they deserve the same help from all of us to keep them rolling along. Its a tough enough market out there without having retards bashing your products on you own damn forum.

Wait, so all this "IONS SUCK OMG" and "Your shiny unreliable POS cheater gun".. that's not bashing other markers?

The new owners at AGD haven't done anything worth supporting. They've recycled old ideas at high prices, something any 15 year old can understand is not going to sell guns in this game.

But hey, you're the boss. I guess ignorance doesn't flee with age.

[Tunaman]

Wait, so all this "IONS SUCK OMG" and "Your shiny unreliable POS cheater gun".. that's not bashing other markers?

The new owners at AGD haven't done anything worth supporting. They've recycled old ideas at high prices, something any 15 year old can understand is not going to sell guns in this game.

But hey, you're the boss. I guess ignorance doesn't flee with age.

All of AGD's prices are lower than they have ever been. Talk about ignorant? Really...if you dont think they are worth supporting, then go to some other forum that suits your needs. And dont let the door hit you in the arse.....
And part of the reason you dont see a new electro from AGD has a little to do with the fact that AGD doesnt want to pay another company to sell a marker that AGD actually designed way back in 1972. But you didnt know that either...
They ARE working on a new marker...but you didn't know that either I guess...

[Pyroboy597]

ULT, Trigger frame, and $250 valve are all unneccesary, just like the endless supply of expensive spyder upgrades. and you dont have to pay to have your gun not chop.. although Kingman now has an anti chop bolt.. that you pay for, to have your spyder not chop.

am I the only one who thinks that if you have an electro hopper feeding faster than your max rof that you wont chop?

if you are going to say a spyder can outshoot a minimag, maybe you should specify which spyder.. as there are quite a few out there. only an electro spyder could outshoot a mag. a stock mech spyder trigger is long pre and post travel. The mag is harder but shorter, its a nice crisp trigger. which can actually result in a higher rof than a mech spyder.

If you were referring to an electro spyder, then sure, the spyder could outshoot a mag.. but then if you arent using full auto, trying to walk the trigger, or fan it or whatever will result in not the best accuracy.. where as the stock mag, at near its max rof out of box will put its paint on target due to less recoil and a more stable hold on the gun... well that will depend on how you fire your marker and how the tank is set up. but from my experience shooting an electro spyder my shots were far less accurate than the same set up with a mech frame, or my mag I had used previously.

im willing to bet that i can shoot faster on a stock Spyder Compact Deluxe than u can on a stock Minimag, and i saved myself 240$

[teufelhunden]

All of AGD's prices are lower than they have ever been. Talk about ignorant? Really...if you dont think they are worth supporting, then go to some other forum that suits your needs. And dont let the door hit you in the arse.....
And part of the reason you dont see a new electro from AGD has a little to do with the fact that AGD doesnt want to pay another company to sell a marker that AGD actually designed way back in 1972. But you didnt know that either...
They ARE working on a new marker...but you didn't know that either I guess...

You say that all of AGD's prices are lower than they've ever been.. and yet, they're still charging $300

[GT]

Over the years it's become apparent to me that paintball is almost entirely based on opinion. The trouble starts when we start taking opinions as facts.

Personally, I don't like RT 'mags. I think you need an adjustable reg.

I think LVL 10 sucks, it's a touchy design, I don't want to drive my gun back into the gear bag over one microscopic fit issue (I hate on/off pins).

AKA Sidewinders are hyped to hell and back, but mine has been just like anything else I've used.

A lot of people say Intimidators are cheap POS, I disagree it's definately 90% user error (I've seen people that didn't know how to remove the detents).

Tippmanns are a better value than the mags, especially at AGDs price. Once you start adding all the new stuff you run into reliablility issues that weren't there before, but all these are my opinions that I've concluded to through experiance, and I nobody can change my mind until I see whatever it is myself.

Quoted for clarity of your opinion. Until there is some kind of benchmark or standard there will be little more than opinion. I guess weight, efficeincy, bps, cps, and consistancy will have to do for now. Notice I didnt say price.

Opinion piece: 300fps is 300 fps, whether its a spyder on c02 or the hottest splamaster; at the end of the day you need a gun that works everytime; out of the box with little regard for user error and easy user servicibility. No fancy adjustments, tools, new LPRs, software updates to get the dam thing to run as purchased. All other forms of measurement are null....

When you begin to consider those points there are very few guns that fit the bill and the ones that do are made by AGD.