Al Qaeda materials found in Iraq!

[FactsOfLife]

Originally posted by Collegeboy
Why do you think that hardly anything you have said has changed my mind?

Answering that would get me banned....


Or C) You are wrong and so entrenched in your position that to admit you are wrong would destroy your perfect little Collegeboy world!

must be nice living in fantasy land 24/7....

[Collegeboy]

Originally posted by FactsOfLife


must be nice living in fantasy land 24/7....

I don't know, how is it FOL.

[Grubel]

Wasn't Osama bin Laden trained by the CIA in the eighties?

The same eighties when Saddam Hussein gassed the Kurds?

[Collegeboy]

Originally posted by Grubel
Wasn't Osama bin Laden trained by the CIA in the eighties?

The same eighties when Saddam Hussein gassed the Kurds?

Watch out they will soon be calling you anti-American, soldier hater, etc.......

[shartley]

Originally posted by Collegeboy


Watch out they will soon be calling you anti-American, soldier hater, etc.......

[Jeffy-CanCon]

Originally posted by Collegeboy

...

Proof is all I ask for.

When I post facts and then my opinions, attack the opinions not me, disprove the facts, don't say that I am this or I am that. That is what is wrong with you all, you are so fast to issue insults with out backing, instead of debating.

...

OK

Originally posted by Collegeboy

The Sinai War (1956)

The invasion and temprorary conquest of Egypt's Sinai Peninsula by Israel, while France and Great Britain seized the Suez Canal.

The Six-Day War (1967)

Israel attacked the military forces of Egypt, Jordan and Syria and seized large amounts of land from each. Iraq also participated in the fighting on the Arab side.

That is an oversimplification of events. Why did Israel fight in 1956, and again 1967? You don't say either because you don't know, or you know and realize that they had good reasons.

1956 - From about 1950 on Southern Israel was under near constant guerrilla attack from Egyptian-backed Palestinians in Gaza. The Israelis went to war to push back the frontier and protect their own settlers. Even so, they might not have done so without the backing of the French and British, who wanted to use an Israeli attack on Egypt as a pretext for seizing back the Suez Canal.

1967 - Then, as now, Israel was surrounded, heavily outnumbered and under frequent guerilla and terrorist attack. In order to fight a war the Israelis must call up their army reserve - a manpower drain that cripples their economy if held for more than about ten days. Israeli intelligence strongly expected the Arab states to attack, and advised the government to strike first or risk defeat.
If anything, the narrowness of their victory in 1973 justifies that call.


...

The Israeli Invasion of Lebanon (1982-1984)

Israel invaded

Those of us who study history know this to be true.

[/QUOTE]

1982 - Lebanon was in the middle of their civil war, and Southern Lebanon was largely controlled by the PLO. The PLO used their positions in Lebanon to launch rocket and guerrilla attacks on Israeli villages. The Israeli goal was to push the PLO out of Lebanon. When they succeeded, even the Lebanese were glad. (I believe you can find an essay from Chomsky about this in the book "You Are Being Lied To")

I think it is pretty debatable to present Israel as an aggressor under those circumstances. They have been more patient and tolerant than most countries, in their circumstances.

[Collegeboy]

Originally posted by Jeffy-CanCon


OK



That is an oversimplification of events. Why did Israel fight in 1956, and again 1967? You don't say either because you don't know, or you know and realize that they had good reasons.

1956 - From about 1950 on Southern Israel was under near constant guerrilla attack from Egyptian-backed Palestinians in Gaza. The Israelis went to war to push back the frontier and protect their own settlers. Even so, they might not have done so without the backing of the French and British, who wanted to use an Israeli attack on Egypt as a pretext for seizing back the Suez Canal.

1967 - Then, as now, Israel was surrounded, heavily outnumbered and under frequent guerilla and terrorist attack. In order to fight a war the Israelis must call up their army reserve - a manpower drain that cripples their economy if held for more than about ten days. Israeli intelligence strongly expected the Arab states to attack, and advised the government to strike first or risk defeat.
If anything, the narrowness of their victory in 1973 justifies that call.


...

The Israeli Invasion of Lebanon (1982-1984)

Israel invaded

Those of us who study history know this to be true.

1982 - Lebanon was in the middle of their civil war, and Southern Lebanon was largely controlled by the PLO. The PLO used their positions in Lebanon to launch rocket and guerrilla attacks on Israeli villages. The Israeli goal was to push the PLO out of Lebanon. When they succeeded, even the Lebanese were glad. (I believe you can find an essay from Chomsky about this in the book "You Are Being Lied To")

I think it is pretty debatable to present Israel as an aggressor under those circumstances. They have been more patient and tolerant than most countries, in their circumstances. [/QUOTE]

It doesn't matter why they invaded, they invaded, and for the debate that was all that is needed. It was to debunk the false notion that Army gave that the Arabs attacked every time. If you will look at the name of the Israeli group during the partition plans, you will see that Jewish Israelis were pushing the Palestinians out of the land going to be given to them in the partition, and the UN was not doing anything about it.

[Sir_Brass]

That's b/c Army was right on the money! They WERE under constant attack. Now, just b/c they invaded did not meant that they were the aggressors. It means they were the first to come across their boarder and bring the fight to their aggressors and push them out.

[Collegeboy]

Originally posted by Sir_Brass
That's b/c Army was right on the money! They WERE under constant attack. Now, just b/c they invaded did not meant that they were the aggressors. It means they were the first to come across their boarder and bring the fight to their aggressors and push them out.

So were the Palestinians too as I have shown.

[ShooterJM]

Originally posted by Collegeboy


So were the Palestinians too as I have shown.

Explain please? Or are you refering to the haganah?

[Collegeboy]

Originally posted by ShooterJM


Explain please? Or are you refering to the haganah?

I am referring to the Palestinians being under constant attack during their entire existence, and yes I used the Haganah to show why Palestinians didn't sign the agreement.

[1stdeadeye]

Originally posted by Collegeboy

I am referring to the Palestinians being under constant attack during their entire existence, and yes I used the Haganah to show why Palestinians didn't sign the agreement.

And the Israeli's weren't?

How many Palestinians have been killed by Israeli suicide murderers (they don't deserve the bomber title)?

Oh yeah, none!!!!!!!!!!!

[FactsOfLife]

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Collegeboy

I am referring to the Palestinians being under constant attack during their entire existence, and yes I used the Haganah to show why Palestinians didn't sign the agreement.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------




Is he still posting this drivel?

[Jeffy-CanCon]

Originally posted by Collegeboy

It doesn't matter why they invaded, they invaded, and for the debate that was all that is needed. It was to debunk the false notion that Army gave that the Arabs attacked every time. If you will look at the name of the Israeli group during the partition plans, you will see that Jewish Israelis were pushing the Palestinians out of the land going to be given to them in the partition, and the UN was not doing anything about it.

There have Jews in that region for a very long time, but they were a tiny minority until after WW1, when the Sykes-Picot Agreement promised them a homeland in Palestine. When Jewish settlers/refugees started to move in, Arab militants began attacking them almost instantly. The first deaths were in riots during 1920 & 1921. Serious Arab militias were formed in the early 1930's, and initiated a major civil war in 1936-39.

I believe that in 1947-48 the Haganah was striking in (pre-emptive) self-defense. And given the recent history of Jews in the 1940's, I think that was pretty understandable.

BTW - "Haganah" is Hebrew for "Self-defense"

None of this is intended to say that the Israelis are entirely blameless in the way that the conflict continues. They do a share of the bad things, too.

(This is pretty far off-topic for Al-Qaeda Materials found in Iraq!)

[FactsOfLife]

Originally posted by Jeffy-CanCon



(This is pretty far off-topic for Al-Qaeda Materials found in Iraq!)

Which is a classic Mr. Irrelevant tactic.


Get this thread back on topic please!