Lat Ion post from me.... I Swear

[BD_Paintball]

[fire1811]

Then you are stpid and blind.

this is the comeback when they run out of facts

[minimag03]

There is too much hate on this thread. Let them say what they want, no matter how uneducated, unfounded, or bias they are. Believe me, their words will speak for themself.

[Duzzy]

This entire thread is getting really stupid.

This is AO, a forum that is supposed to be more mature, and well behaved than a group of 8 year olds who aren't getting their way. It hasn't gotten to the point where I will compare it to PBN but I feel like it.

Yes this is an Automag Owners Group. Yes, I am sure there is an Ion Owners Group. That doesn't mean anything. It means that people own more than 1 type of marker, and want to talk about more than just that one marker. What a horrible thing to think I know, but it is probably pretty close to the truth.

I think that people hate SP mainly because of the patent deal. If it were only because of poor QC I doubt anyone would be this zealous in their hatred. I also think that no one here really understands what affect this lawsuit really had, myself included.

I think it was a pretty low blow, but it was also smart business. No matter what else you say there is no denying that the people who run Smart Parts are good business people.

The Ion is here to stay, why I am not buying one is for reasons of my own, and I really don't feel that posting them here would do anything constructive.

However, turning a blind eye to all the potentially good things the Ion may do for the sport is foolish. You don't have to like a company to acknowledge that they did something good, or made a decent product.

I really wish this would just stop. The Ion is the new big thing, so until it stops being the new big thing then there will be posts about it, live with it. AO is not here to be a safe harbor for bigots of any kind.

I guess I fully expect this to be ignored, most of my posts are... But maybe it will do some good.

[Paintchucker]

wait......the frame is permanetly connected to the asa??????so i cant put a rail on that thing? that means no one can use adjustable tanks with it?

You can make your own rail out of plexiglass or aluminum stock and then build whatever body you want around it... Well, I think that you can. I will let you know in a couple weeks... LOL After the cast resin body experiment is done...

Yeh.. because everyone who buys SP is a lemming. None of us make informed decisions based on the positives and negatives of what we are buying. If you buy SP it must be about the hype

But I thought the hype was the bonus !!! I just wanted something cool to play with that wouldn't cost me an arm and a leg...

[Beemer]

Ya ok

Then you are stpid and blind.

My point is asshat

This is nice, and you are a writer? Time and time again I see your posts with name calling and what not. AO Zombies etc.. etc...[got any warnings yet] If your so cool why dont you try posting like a professional writer, with a little class and style. Pay attention to how Lohman posts and maybe you will learn something. If you cant reply to a negative with a positive then why bother???????? In your words, no one cares. In my opinion posters like you are part of the problem not the answer.

You do realize, if everyone who did not own an automag walked from this forum that it would be a much smaller, much more lonely place and you would loose a lot of knowledge right?

To a degree this might be true, but a high percentage of these would be the uninformed and uneducated, so would it really matter?

[bound for glory]

you the man, beemer

[Twiek]

I think these discussion would serve a better purpose if only people who owned one would comment.

But according to you, that invalidates their opinion:

(Why is it that the simple purchasing of a specific marker automatically creates some crazy bond that ties the owner to it in such a why that all logic and reason get's thrown out the window during emotional attempt to defend it honor? )

(That statement, BTW, is why I stopped my end of the discussion in that thread... I hate cheap-shots)

and i really don't think you understand the operating concept behind the devilmag. i don't think the blow forword system can be termed a sear tripper.

The devilmag has a sear. It is tripped by an actuator. It's even an electronic adaptation of a 'mech marker. It is, therefore, a sear tripper. Just like an E-Mag or e-spyder. Not to say that they're bad markers... but they are sear trippers.

To a degree this might be true, but a high percentage of these would be the uninformed and uneducated, so would it really matter?

This qualifies as a Facist statement. Why don't we just drag all the non-'mag owners out into the street and shoot them in the head... they're inferior anyway

So non-mag owners are uninformed and uneducated? And what, then, qualifies a person to post on this board? That they currently own a 'mag? That they have owned a 'mag in the past? Or that they plan on getting a 'mag and have questions? And who's the judge of who qualifies?

Do you realize how many people purchase 'mags after they have found this place and read the discussions? Do you really want to drive those people away... or are they just not good enough (i.e. uninformed and uneducated)?

[Beemer]

This qualifies as a Facist statement. Why don't we just drag all the non-'mag owners out into the street and shoot them in the head... they're inferior anyway

So non-mag owners are uninformed and uneducated? And what, then, qualifies a person to post on this board? That they currently own a 'mag? That they have owned a 'mag in the past? Or that they plan on getting a 'mag and have questions? And who's the judge of who qualifies?

Do you realize how many people purchase 'mags after they have found this place and read the discussions? Do you really want to drive those people away... or are they just not good enough (i.e. uninformed and uneducated)?

Im a big boy. You got me on that one. I think Lohman knows what I was trying to say. But you are right and I am wrong, I should have worded my post in another way. Facist..No, stereotypical ya.

It works both ways though. How many people came here and didnt buy a Mag after they read some.
It was basically a generalization of the paintball populace, not non Mag owners specifically

Welcome to the minority

I.A.D.S.P.B.P

[magmonkey]

"It's kind of sick how many people out there only have the motive to support the gun based on brand"
my little company almost didn't exist anymore because of SP and their loose bussiness morals
we were doing nothing wrong, and we could no longer go on customizing the marker that we had put so much time money and effort into. I have three machine payments, two computers to program the machines, almost $20,000 in software and the time of myself and my partners in creating our custom vikings, things were going great for us with thenwith a little under 40 markers built we had the rug pulled out from under us by SP

I have every right to support a marker based on brand...

smart parts can kiss my @ss.

[Lohman446]

"It's kind of sick how many people out there only have the motive to support the gun based on brand"
my little company almost didn't exist anymore because of SP and their loose bussiness morals
we were doing nothing wrong, and we could no longer go on customizing the marker that we had put so much time money and effort into. I have three machine payments, two computers to program the machines, almost $20,000 in software and the time of myself and my partners in creating our custom vikings, things were going great for us with them and wuth a little under 40 markers built we had the rug pulled out from under us by SP

I have every right to support a marker based on brand...

smart parts can kiss my @ss.

Now wait a moment here. Two things, obviously you have far more knowledge of the situation, the "technology", and the operation than I do... I give you now that you may very well be right. And you are right, you did nothing wrong... is it all SPs fault or is it partly AKAs and to some degree your own?

AKA made a marker that was in violation of SPs patent. Apparently the violation was obvious enough and undefendable enough that they chose not to defend it (there are obviously other possibilities). You depended on AKA to have made a marker that they legally could make. Partially your fault for not researching this but to be fair... well who could have expected you to.

Yes.. SP stopped production, but AKA agreed to it. Is it not possible for you to continue profitaly by using another base marker? I know SP is fond of private labels but I understand the animosity there. Can WGP, WDP, BLAST, or ICP not offer you a base for yours skills to shine one? It is a wrench in your works, but with your equipment, and your ingenuity and design skills, which based on your past works I have great respect for is it not possible to move forward?

A lot of what I said may not strike anyone as being particuallarly fair. The patent deal was not particularly fair either, I agree to some degree with that - though not to the "they should have done nothing" degree of others. I don't mean to insult you in any way if I have, and I have respect for what you have done in the past. I would hate to think that you would allow one hurdle to end it all, after all the hurdles you have already overcome. I don't mean to come off as some SP zealot either... I do try to consider both sides of the issues, and would like to think I have a middle of the road view. Obviously with minimal personal investment (time, energy, money) I can have an understandably "softer" view than anyone at Destructive Customs. I also think they can justify a much stronger view than the line some people seem to take.

In regards to Beemers comment: I understand what you said, my original knee jerk reaction was that you were wrong and that most of the very knowledgeable people on these forums may not even own am ag, let alone use it regularly. Quantitative data is prooving me wrong though... and I must admit you're statement, in meaning, holds a lot of truth.

[BD_Paintball]

"It's kind of sick how many people out there only have the motive to support the gun based on brand"
my little company almost didn't exist anymore because of SP and their loose bussiness morals
we were doing nothing wrong, and we could no longer go on customizing the marker that we had put so much time money and effort into. I have three machine payments, two computers to program the machines, almost $20,000 in software and the time of myself and my partners in creating our custom vikings, things were going great for us with thenwith a little under 40 markers built we had the rug pulled out from under us by SP

I have every right to support a marker based on brand...

smart parts can kiss my @ss.

[ApexAZ]

Stop the hate, seriously.

[tyrion2323]

Why do you all continue to argue about the ION?

If you like the Ion, then buy it. If you don't like the Ion, then don't.

Look, you can argue all day long about whether something is good or bad or whatever...in the end, it's fruitless.

[Lohman446]

Why do you all continue to argue about the ION?

If you like the Ion, then buy it. If you don't like the Ion, then don't.

Look, you can argue all day long about whether something is good or bad or whatever...in the end, it's fruitless.

Because I for one like to debate. I like to beleive that I know the strengths and weaknesses of each marker that I am interested in. Perhaps someday I will decide I want to build one and these hours I have spent in discussion will aide me in decisions involved in the design and manufactur. Perhaps, some of us, are considering our retirement to involve a barely profitable field set off the road somewhere that will give us something to do without needing to be highly profitable (I think thats my goal for retirement).

Its not fruitless. I get to hear a lot of different opinions, and often why those opinions are held. If nothing else it gives me interesting mental and intellectual excersises in a field I am interested in. Perhaps we will never come to an agreement that everyone is part of, but I don't consider it fruitless.