** Official Level 10 Problems Thread **

[Ando]

Hmm...ya..

[athomas]

Shims in the level 10 won't help that. It sounds like the small top on-off oring is out of place.

[keyk17]

Tuning Lvl 10 -- Full Auto???

Here is an issue my buddy and I are having with his RT Pro ULE. He was taking it apart to try to re-tune the Lvl 10.

No shims were added/removed (only 1 in there); he was going to put a lighter spring in but decided against it.

When he reassembled the marker (with no changes having been made) and gassed it up, it now goes full-auto with only a slight touch of the trigger. We can't figure out why it's RTing constantly.

We tried it with 2 shims but the same effect is present. Any ideas on how to troubleshoot this one guys?

Thanks.

[athomas]

Got my x valve with a 10 lvl air is bassing through the valve because i can hear a slight leak but the gun wont fire any tips?

I'm going to assume you mean the leak is out the front.

You will need to tune your level 10 setup. First, remove all the shims from the powertube. Install the short gold bolt spring to start. Then install the largest carrier size that does not produce a leak. Always use the same white carrier oring when changing carriers. The carriers are actually used to change the inner diameter of the oring, so it is important that you use the same one in each carrier that you use. Don't bother putting the shims back in.

Once you get the gun to fire without bolt stick or leaking, adjust the bolt spring. The bolt spring you should use is the one that allows you to operate the gun at about 20fps above the lowest velocity that the gun starts to cycle at. If the red bolt spring allows the gun to start cycling at 260fps, then the ideal operating velocity would be about 280fps. If the gun starts cycling at 285fps, then the ideal operating velocity would be about 305fps which is too high. You would need to use a shorter bolt spring to lower the starting velocity in this case.

[Ando]

Where is the leak coming from?

[falcon115]

wont shoot

Got my x valve with a 10 lvl air is bassing through the valve because i can hear a slight leak but the gun wont fire any tips?

[athomas]

I'm assuming it's the tension on the spring and pin that adjusts the velocity. If so, I believe it is working like it should.

I took the adjuster cap off, and removed the shim stack, then replaced the adjuster cap. It went inside much lower without the shim stack, than it was able to with the shims. I don't think adding washers will really help with that...though I think I'll still pick some up.

More tension equals more pressure which equals more velocity. You can only add tension until the adjuster cap bottoms out. Adding a couple of washers, puts more tension on the spring pack at any given position. This will increase your available velocity. This velocity adjustment problem was found on some aftermarket adjusters. The washers just compensate for the difference in position between the stock adjuster and the aftermarket one.

[Drachen]

Did you measure the paint? If you put it in the insert, it should be just slightly touching on two points opposite each other for best fit. Some paint has been getting pretty small these days. Judging by the bore you are using, this is probably the case here. This would be exaggerated in the stiffy barrel because of the short control bore. The control bore of the freak is a bit longer which is probably helping achieve a higher velocity.

Since you have an aftermarket upgrade on your valve, it is possible that the adjuster you have on the back won't allow the full range of velocity adjustment. Try putting a couple of washers inside the velocity adjuster cap to increase the adjustment depth. This should allow a higher velocity to be obtained.

I'm assuming it's the tension on the spring and pin that adjusts the velocity. If so, I believe it is working like it should.

I took the adjuster cap off, and removed the shim stack, then replaced the adjuster cap. It went inside much lower without the shim stack, than it was able to with the shims. I don't think adding washers will really help with that...though I think I'll still pick some up.

[athomas]

It's been a while since I've owned a mag, and even longer since I've tried to tune one. So I apologize if this seems like a rookie mistake lol.

I recently got one of the 2k9 Micromags, and a Shocktech/AM valve and reg, with the level 10 bolt. Yesterday, with the small paint we had, I was getting pretty low velocity (230-240) with a approximate .689 stiffi barrel. The velocity adjuster is all the way in, I cannot turn it any further if I wanted to.

Though when I went with a very small underbore, with my .670 brass insert on the Freak, I was getting between 275-284. It is usable with that. Got a little lower with a .679+ sizes. I would just keep underboring, but I'm afraid in the summer when it gets warm and humid, a underbore that low might start to make problems. Either too low and breaks, or too high and low velocity.

Did you measure the paint? If you put it in the insert, it should be just slightly touching on two points opposite each other for best fit. Some paint has been getting pretty small these days. Judging by the bore you are using, this is probably the case here. This would be exaggerated in the stiffy barrel because of the short control bore. The control bore of the freak is a bit longer which is probably helping achieve a higher velocity.

Since you have an aftermarket upgrade on your valve, it is possible that the adjuster you have on the back won't allow the full range of velocity adjustment. Try putting a couple of washers inside the velocity adjuster cap to increase the adjustment depth. This should allow a higher velocity to be obtained.

[Drachen]

Low velocity

It's been a while since I've owned a mag, and even longer since I've tried to tune one. So I apologize if this seems like a rookie mistake lol.

I recently got one of the 2k9 Micromags, and a Shocktech/AM valve and reg, with the level 10 bolt. Yesterday, with the small paint we had, I was getting pretty low velocity (230-240) with a approximate .689 stiffi barrel. The velocity adjuster is all the way in, I cannot turn it any further if I wanted to.

Though when I went with a very small underbore, with my .670 brass insert on the Freak, I was getting between 275-284. It is usable with that. Got a little lower with a .679+ sizes. I would just keep underboring, but I'm afraid in the summer when it gets warm and humid, a underbore that low might start to make problems. Either too low and breaks, or too high and low velocity.

[Hook]

Thanks fellow Canuck, will give that a try and let you know how it goes!

[athomas]

Hey guys, having Level 10 issues. The marker will fire fine for a few shots, then the trigger goes limp and you can literally hear the valve slowly filling up for a few seconds, then the sear 'clicks' and the marker can be shot again. I've got 3 shims in the ULT and am using the gold spring.

Also, on a totally unrelated note, what kind of lube should be used on the two springs in the reg portion of the Xvalve? Can I use Dow 33? I know that's the kind of lube used in most vert regs, but I wanted to double check first.

Its probably the residual air leaking out the front that you hear. Once this air leaks out the spring force overcomes the residual air force and pushes the bolt back into place. To correct this, you need to retune your level 10 system. It sounds like you have a carrier size that is too tight. The 3 ULT shims should be fine. Just make sure they are ULT shims and not level 10 shims. If you accidentally put level 10 shims in your ULT, then the timing could be off causing your issue. Each ULT shim is 0.005" thick. Each level 10 shim is 0.01" thick.

Remove all powertube shims first . Then use the largest carrier that does not leak. Always use the same white oring in each carrier that you check. Once you find the proper size carrier, you shouldn't have any problems.

Use any good quality grease on the regulator piston springs. It is only used to prevent the springs from rusting. Grease is used instead of oil because it stays on better during use.

[Hook]

Hey guys, having Level 10 issues. The marker will fire fine for a few shots, then the trigger goes limp and you can literally hear the valve slowly filling up for a few seconds, then the sear 'clicks' and the marker can be shot again. I've got 3 shims in the ULT and am using the gold spring.

Also, on a totally unrelated note, what kind of lube should be used on the two springs in the reg portion of the Xvalve? Can I use Dow 33? I know that's the kind of lube used in most vert regs, but I wanted to double check first.

[athomas]

I guess im not the only one who has had trouble with the epic lvl 10 lol... I feel better now. 70 Pages deep

Its not trouble, its just knowing how to properly set them up. I've never had trouble with any of them, and I've used them and tuned others since I was a beta tester.

[Tropical Life]

I guess im not the only one who has had trouble with the epic lvl 10 lol... I feel better now. 70 Pages deep