** Official Level 10 Problems Thread **

[Mime]

Hello Gentilmen (and possible ladies)
So today I would like to question on how to make my level 10 more sensitive. I have been running my Tac one ( Xvalve + Level 10) for 2 years now. and yesterday something happened which has neven happened before.

I chopped paint.
I chopped Fresh tournament grade paint. on a mild weather day.

So right now im using the Gold spring ( 250 FPS and below) BUT I am using it at about 270 FPS ( field limit is 280 but I leave a little more room due to usually I can find a few renters so I dont want to hit them to hard)

So naturaly I first tried switching to the Red spring ( 265 to 280 FPS) but dispite increaseing the velocity I always got a bad case of the bolt stick ( the bolt would move forward but not reset) and the only way I got it to stop sticking was put it at about 290 FPS ( above field limit) and the silver spring is out of question.

Also yesterday something slightly strange happened, I would notice a leak down the power tube ( when trigger was released) would occur If I left the marker without shooting for a few minutes ( like a developing leak) but when I shot it the leak would dis-appear for a few minutes ( which was fine As I was shooting during the game)

Would I need to go up a carrier size to increase sensitivity on the Level ten, but at the same time shim it to death to try and stop the devleoping leak? Or would I need to change Orings?

Also, I forgot how the Carriers sizing goes, is it one dot being smallest and 2 dots being largest, going "1 Dot, 2 dash Dash, 3 Dot dash, 4 Dot, dot."

thank you for your time in advance, any questions I will try to answer.

Edit: Found the Carrier sizing chart, so there is 8 carriers and I only own 4 lol. guess I'll make due.

Also re-read the Valve tuning guides, they state that if it leaks down the barrel and I slighty push on it if the tone changes then I must move down a carrier size, and if it leaks afterwards then remove shims.

Any opinions from you guys?

[athomas]

Thanks for the quick reply, the gun starts firing reliably at ab 255-260 with the short spring so that sounds ab right.

Yes, it definately looks like the short spring is the one for your setup.

[Soonersdds]

Thanks for the quick reply, the gun starts firing reliably at ab 255-260 with the short spring so that sounds ab right.

[athomas]

OK first off here is the setup, classic valve, HPA preset at 850 psi. I went to install the level 10 bolt on my mag and started off with the shortest spring in the kit, 1.5 carrier and 2 shims, of course lots of oil. Gun shoots consistently at 285 fps, no leaks, and bolt re-sets with no sticking. Shot a case of paint through it with no problems.

So of course I get greedy and try to use the red spring since i hear it is even softer on paint, install it with the same setup described above, gun won't shoot, turn up pressure (which uses nearly all the threading on the nut) till it does start to shoot but the gun chronos at 385 fps and is leaking out the back only. If I turn the screw down a little to stop the leak out the back the gun will not shoot.

Should I just stick with the short spring setup that worked fine, will I not be able to use the red spring, or will the new reg piston pack on the website solve this and allow me to shoot the red spring consistently at a velocity of 285-295? Thanks in advance for the help.

It sounds like the short spring is the one that works for your setup. What is the lowest velocity that the gun will shoot at while using the short spring? This will give you a good indication of how it is working. For optimum performance, the operating velocity should be set at about 20fps above the lowest value where it starts cycling.

The higher pressure that causes the velocity to be over 300 fps could be a result of the barrel that you are using. A new spring pack doesn't change the pressure that it takes to move the bolt forward, so that won't help you.

[Soonersdds]

lvl 10, classic valve

OK first off here is the setup, classic valve, HPA preset at 850 psi. I went to install the level 10 bolt on my mag and started off with the shortest spring in the kit, 1.5 carrier and 2 shims, of course lots of oil. Gun shoots consistently at 285 fps, no leaks, and bolt re-sets with no sticking. Shot a case of paint through it with no problems.

So of course I get greedy and try to use the red spring since i hear it is even softer on paint, install it with the same setup described above, gun won't shoot, turn up pressure (which uses nearly all the threading on the nut) till it does start to shoot but the gun chronos at 385 fps and is leaking out the back only. If I turn the screw down a little to stop the leak out the back the gun will not shoot.

Should I just stick with the short spring setup that worked fine, will I not be able to use the red spring, or will the new reg piston pack on the website solve this and allow me to shoot the red spring consistently at a velocity of 285-295? Thanks in advance for the help.

[Looper]

Was looking for a reason why out the box it would have issues. Instead i get loose the attitude
and this is not the place for but here I go
My second marker was automag classic
then a minimag (bought the first one to arrive at my local store, damn im old) then rt classic then an emag and now a ule custom, and since my first AGD marker I have never played with anything other the AGD ever. And when I'm on the field and some fool says oh I have auto mag in storage or in the closet, I talk crap to him all day about how he need to stop playing with a child's toy and use an automag. Since all my markers now have lvl10, I very familiar with tuning a lvl 10 but the point is I expected more out the box, and I admit that it may have been wrong of me to expect it to go from the ups guys hands to right onto the field.

I'm sorry my suggestions did not work for you.

[athomas]

Was looking for a reason why out the box it would have issues. Instead i get loose the attitude

This was probably because of the wft in the title.

.....I very familiar with tuning a lvl 10 but the point is I expected more out the box, and I admit that it may have been wrong of me to expect it to go from the ups guys hands to right onto the field.

AGD does generic tuning. The problem is that it may have worked when the oring was freshly wet and at atmospheric conditions. After the gun sat for a while in stock, and then arrived to your area which has different atmospheric conditions, the tension on the carrier oring could have changed. Since operation of the level 10 requires it to be such a finely tuned device, any small changes in pressure/force can affect its performance. I've seen lots of the mags come out of the box and not work properly until the level 10 is retuned. It is a simple fix. Just go to the next larger carrier size using the same white oring.

[automagman2000]

My ule custom had bolt stick issues also. Even when i went to larger carrier sizes it still would have a nasty bolt stick. Solution for me, OIL the crap out of it. After some oil and a few cases of paint, my marker shoots ropes with no breaks.

[ndnfeather]

now you done it

First
loose the attitude.

Second
The thumb screw should be finger tight only and the front frame screw does not want to be too tight either.

Was looking for a reason why out the box it would have issues. Instead i get loose the attitude
and this is not the place for but here I go
My second marker was automag classic
then a minimag (bought the first one to arrive at my local store, damn im old) then rt classic then an emag and now a ule custom, and since my first AGD marker I have never played with anything other the AGD ever. And when I'm on the field and some fool says oh I have auto mag in storage or in the closet, I talk crap to him all day about how he need to stop playing with a child's toy and use an automag. Since all my markers now have lvl10, I very familiar with tuning a lvl 10 but the point is I expected more out the box, and I admit that it may have been wrong of me to expect it to go from the ups guys hands to right onto the field.

[athomas]

Tried out my brand new ULE custom and right out the box LVL 10 bolt would stick and not re-cock. I would have to stick have to take a squeegee put it down the barrel to re-cock it.



suggestions?

Sometimes they aren't tuned properly. Do your standard level 10 tuning procedures.

- Remove all the level 10 shims first.
- Install the largest carrier that does not leak.
- Always use the same white carrier oring when changing carrier sizes.

[Looper]

Tried out my brand new ULE custom and right out the box LVL 10 bolt would stick and not re-cock. I would have to stick have to take a squeegee put it down the barrel to re-cock it.

First
loose the attitude.

Second
The thumb screw should be finger tight only and the front frame screw does not want to be too tight either.

[ndnfeather]

Wtf?

Tried out my brand new ULE custom and right out the box LVL 10 bolt would stick and not re-cock. I would have to stick have to take a squeegee put it down the barrel to re-cock it.



suggestions?

[athomas]

ok im gonna sound like an idiot i know i am prepared for a lashing. but what does it mean when you have air leaking down the barrel, not extremely fast but kinda quick? Sorry I havent tinkered with my mag in about a year and a half im just getting back into it.

Thanks,
Trigger

I'm assuming you have a level 10 bolt installed.

Did it cycle when you pulled the trigger? Did the leak stop when you held the trigger in? Is your rail bushing in place? Since it has been a year, did you add a couple of drops of oil at the valve inlet before you aired it up? Check these and get back with some info about your setup as well.

[trigger090]

ok im gonna sound like an idiot i know i am prepared for a lashing. but what does it mean when you have air leaking down the barrel, not extremely fast but kinda quick? Sorry I havent tinkered with my mag in about a year and a half im just getting back into it.

Thanks,
Trigger

[athomas]

its the same on both end of the spring, so I either need to file down on one end more or replace the spring.

The gun was cronoed at 275-280 and the bolt was sticking with the red spring. Iv used the red spring before at that range with no problems.

If the spring requires you to file it, replace it. You will change the parameters if you start filing it. You could create a weak spot that could fracture and break even though you only take a tiny bit off.

When you used a red spring before, was it with the same barrel? A different barrel would cause the operating pressure to change for that velocity. Whether or not it worked before, always assume a new condition and start from new.